Pages

Sunday, January 22, 2017

Some notes on the crowd size...

Yes - Obama's was bigger
No - Trump's was not small 

First let me suggest that this is a really stupid and pointless argument. Both on the part of the media (whom I expect it from), and especially on the part of the Administration (who quite frankly should have bigger and better things to concern themselves with).
  • There are no and will be no official announcement of any numbers. That had been done by the National Park Service, and they stopped doing so back in the 1990s. What you will have is crowd estimates from a variety of people, but mostly the media. 
  • As I watched the speech live on the internet, they panned out over the crowds and you did not see the large areas of "white' that you do in many of the pictures. The pictures were still shots and could have been taken at any time prior to the speech. Quite obviously the earlier you take a picture as the crowds gather, the less people will show in your picture. Unless of course, someone believes that everyone magically appears all at once.
  • On that note, the covering of the fields in a "white" tarp had never been done before. Generally there had been no covering of the area, which would obviously make it harder to distinguish where there may be open spots, as people and a brown/green ground would naturally blend much better than people and "white". 
  • There were white areas that were "blocked off" due to security reasons. Again, the fact that the ground was white makes these areas show up. But it begs the question, why would those areas be otherwise vacant when thousands were watching from way further back?
  • The television ratings show that Donald Trumps inauguration was the fourth most watched inauguration at approximately 31 million. This trails Ronald Reagan in 1980 with 42 million and Barack Obama in 2008 at 38 million and Jimmy Carter in 1976 with 34 million.

For the record, I don't believe that the Trump crowd size in D.C. was comparable to the Obama crowd size, which was historically large by all accounts. 2017 was probably very similar to most of the other inauguration crowds. That being said, when you consider how much the international community has advanced in terms of media access, it's certainly "possible" that 2017 was the most "watched" world wide, which is the suggestion being made by the Administration.

Not that it really matters.  

42 comments:

Loretta Russo said...

"Barack Obama in 2008 at 38 million"

Hopy and changy was vogue.

There's that, and the demographics of DC - blacks and government workers.

opie said...

No - Trump's was not small

His spokesman said largest, unlike his hands. LOLOL But I give them lots of credit, discussing the size of his crowd and ignoring the millions who marched yesterday. Avoided giving any credit to those that peacefully marched. Good job on focusing on him, rather than reality.

Roger Amick said...

Here’s the truth, which exists even if the administration doesn’t want to admit it: Fewer people attended Trump’s inauguration than attended some previous inaugurations. Keith Still, a professor at Manchester Metropolitan University and expert on crowd estimates, told The New York Times that, based on photographs, he believed Trump’s crowd was about one-third the size of the group that gathered for Barack Obama’s 2009 inauguration.


There is plenty of evidence that the Trump administration is wrong about the crowd sizes that goes beyond what you can see with your own eyes. There were only 570,000 trips taken on the Metro, Washington’s mass transit system, on Friday ― the lowest total for an inauguration day since 2005. (There were 1.1 million Metro trips on the day of Obama’s 2009 inauguration and 782,000 in 2013, according to WAMU’s Martin di Caro.)

Fewer people watched it on television, too. Some 30.6 million people watched Trump’s inauguration on TV, according to Nielsen ratings. That’s 7 million or so fewer than watched Obama’s first inaugural ― nearly 20 percent less. (Ronald Reagan’s first inauguration still holds the record.)

And in his statement Saturday, Spicer said, falsely, for the “first time in our nation’s history that floor covering has been used to protect the grass on the mall.” NBC Washington reported in 2013 that workers were scrambling to put in place grass protections ahead of Obama’s second inauguration. The press secretary also claimed that magnetometers on the National Mall limited access to the event. However, the Secret Service told CNN that “no magnetometers were used on the National Mall for Trump’s inauguration,” according to Jim Acosta. And Spicer claimed that the crowd extended from the Capitol to the Washington Monument. Photos show that it did not. All of this was easily checkable.

These falsehoods were so obvious ― and unnecessary ― that many in the news media, from the reporters summoned to the White House on a Saturday afternoon to others left in disbelief on Twitter, immediately pushed back against Trump and his team’s nonsensical spin.

One of media’s principal failings during the 2016 campaign was not challenging the lies and other unsupported claims Trump uttered in interviews, on Twitter and in rambling speeches carried live on television. Trump’s unprecedented dishonesty as a candidate only continued as president-elect. And too often, news organizations continued falling into the trap of credulously amplifying his claims that have no basis in reality.

But perhaps the media is catching on now that Trump has taken office. On Saturday, several news organizations and journalists on Twitter quickly refuted Spicer’s bogus claim, with some even calling it a lie.

Four Pinochios

Roger Amick said...

Your ability to accept a lie is stunning.

You need to read this.

Nineteen Eighty-Four, often published as 1984, is a dystopian novel by English author George Orwell published in 1949.[1][2] The novel is set in Airstrip One (formerly known as Great Britain), a province of the superstate Oceania in a world of perpetual war, omnipresent government surveillance, and public manipulation. The superstate is dictated by a political regime euphemistically named English Socialism (or Ingsoc in the government's invented language, Newspeak). The superstate is under the control of a privileged elite of the Inner Party, that persecutes individualism and independent thinking as "thoughtcrime".[3]

The tyranny is overseen by Big Brother, the Party leader who enjoys an intense cult of personality, but who may not even exist. The Party "seeks power entirely for its own sake. It is not interested in the good of others; it is interested solely in power."[4] The protagonist of the novel, Winston Smith, is a member of the Outer Party, who works for the Ministry of Truth (or Minitrue in Newspeak), which is responsible for propaganda and historical revisionism. His job is to rewrite past newspaper articles, so that the historical record always supports the party line.[5] The instructions that the workers receive specify the corrections as fixing misquotations and never as what they really are: forgeries and falsifications. A large part of the Ministry also actively destroys all documents that have been edited and do not contain the revisions; in this way, no proof exists that the government is lying. Smith is a diligent and skillful worker but secretly hates the Party and dreams of rebellion against Big Brother. The heroine of the novel, Julia, is based on Orwell's second wife, Sonia Orwell.[6][7]

As literary political fiction and dystopian science-fiction, Nineteen Eighty-Four is a classic novel in content, plot and style. Many of its terms and concepts, such as Big Brother, doublethink, thoughtcrime, Newspeak, Room 101, telescreen, 2 + 2 = 5, and memory hole, have entered into common use since its publication in 1949. Nineteen Eighty-Four popularised the adjective Orwellian, which describes official deception, secret surveillance, and manipulation of recorded history by a totalitarian or authoritarian state.[5] In 2005, the novel was chosen by Time magazine as one of the 100 best English-language novels from 1923 to 2005.[8] It was awarded a place on both lists of Modern Library 100 Best Novels, reaching number 13 on the editor's list, and 6 on the readers' list.[9] In 2003, the novel was listed at number 8 on the BBC's survey The Big Read.[10]

wphamilton said...

Looking at just the side-by-side photos I am inclined to agree with smaller than Obama's crowd but not so sparse as NY Times and WaPo would have it.

In addition to the white tarp, the Trump photo is from a higher angle which would show more ground between people, and it is at a much lower resolution which might miss individuals in the smoothing.

Roger Amick said...

Every agrees that the crowd wasn't as large as 2009. The problem I have, is that Trump and his press secretary, bot blatantly lied about the size of the crowd. I think lies matter, especially coming from a President, and our host accepts the lies and says "So what".

He spent years calling Obama a liar on the ACA, and yesterday said he was upset by what he saw as lies on job creation. But President Trump can lie and he just shakes it off as not important.

Words matter, especially when the President of the United States is speaking. If no one will believe a thing he says, he will not be able to get anyone to work with him on anything.

he also stood in front of the wall of stars, each one representing an American who gave his or her life in the defense of our country, and lied about the crowd size, attacked the media that dares call out his lies, and even worse, he blatantly lied about his criticism of the CIA and other intelligence services.

Our host seems to have lost the ability to call out a politician on his lies because he's a Republican It's sad.

Indy Voter said...

It's not okay to describe anything about this president as being small...

Roger Amick said...

Indy, it seems that way. Orwell was right.


"The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. And if all others accepted the lie which the party imposed, if all records told the same tale, then the lie passed into history and became the truth." - Orwell 1984

Commonsense said...

Well this is what my eyes saw.

How about yours.

opie said...

Your picture is as good as that graph you used to prove there was economic growth in busch's last quarter and about as reliable.

President Trump’s counselor Kellyanne Conway clashed with “Meet the Press” host Chuck Todd on NBC Sunday over the administration’s false assertion that Trump’s inauguration had the largest crowd in history.

“You’re saying it’s a falsehood,” Conway told Todd. “Sean Spicer, our press secretary, gave alternative facts.”

On Saturday, Spicer used his first official statement to castigate the media for what he called “deliberately false reporting” on the size of the crowd at Trump’s inauguration.

Yep, just like CH, when in doubt provide alternate facts. LOLOL

KD, I love how CHT is Playing Liberals as the fools they are said...

“Watched protests yesterday but was under the impression that we just had an election!” Mr. Trump wrote. “Why didn’t these people vote? Celebs hurt cause badly.” President Trump


Great point Mr President.

KD, Nothing Indy about Indy anymore, bitter yes said...

Anonymous Indy Voter said...
It's not okay to describe anything about this president as being small..."

It is perfectly ok to that and so much more, after all President Trump is not Black.



Loretta Russo said...

"Your ability to accept a lie is stunning."

After eight years of the pathological liar, suddenly Roger is worried about the truth.

Rich I tell ya.

KD said...

Two things about the tampon class, why did they not ROAR on Nov. 8th,2016?

Why are leftist woman so freaking poor?

I mean they act as if they don't get gov't money , they can't get health insurance.


Did you all know that a Working Full Time RN can go on Social Security Disability Insurance and make the same take home. Yes, I learned that today.




T/H to RRB

KD said...

After eight years of the pathological liar, suddenly Roger is worried about the truth.

Rich I tell ya. " Ette

Ette it does not end their, After 8 years of spending like a drunk Community Organizer and adding 10 Trillion to the National debt, all of a Sudden ole stupid Roger is concerned about the National Debt.

Amazing I tell ya.

Loretta Russo said...

"The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. And if all others accepted the lie which the party imposed, if all records told the same tale, then the lie passed into history and became the truth." - Orwell 1984"

"If you like your health care plan, you can keep it," the Lie of the Year for 2013."

opie said...

"If you like your health care plan, you can keep it

Don't listen to his words, listen to his heart....KAC as she spins like loretta.....LOL
250 K just in the bowl....donnie the trump
Won in a landslide! Prince Reebus
GW is a hoax Donnie the trump
His Birth certificate is fake....donnie the trump

And he's only been in charge 1 day

Myballs said...

I loved seeing kellyann handing todd his ass. Thus Whitehouse isn't gonna stand for the media self absorbed arrogance.

opie said...

Myballs said...
I loved seeing kellyann handing todd his ass.

IOW's ballz enjoys alternate facts in his alternate universe. She sucked as much as spicer did with his lie fest. Good start for donnie the trump.

Roger Amick said...

You accept "Alternate Truth"?
I'm not surprised. She's getting ripped to shreds on Twitter.

Loretta Russo said...

Go fuck yourself.

Loretta Russo said...

"I loved seeing kellyann handing todd his ass. Thus Whitehouse isn't gonna stand for the media self absorbed arrogance."

It was a sight to behold.

Roger Amick said...

Robert Reich

I had breakfast recently with a friend who's a former Republican member of Congress. Here's what he said:

Him: Trump is no Republican. He’s just a big fat ego.

Me: Then why didn’t you speak out against him during the campaign?

Him: You kidding? I was surrounded by Trump voters. I’d have been shot.

Me: So what now? What are your former Republican colleagues going to do?

Him (smirking): They’ll play along for a while.

Me: A while?

Him: They’ll get as much as they want – tax cuts galore, deregulation, military buildup, slash all those poverty programs, and then get to work on Social Security and Medicare – and blame him. And he’s such a fool he’ll want to take credit for everything.

Me: And then what?

Him (laughing): They like Pence.

Me: What do you mean?

Him: Pence is their guy. They all think Trump is out of his mind.

Me: So what?

Him: So the moment Trump does something really dumb – steps over the line – violates the law in a big stupid clumsy way … and you know he will ...

Me: They impeach him?

Him: You bet. They pull the trigger.

Loretta Russo said...

"does not end their, After 8 years of spending like a drunk Community Organizer and adding 10 Trillion to the National debt, all of a Sudden ole stupid Roger is concerned about the National Debt."

Typical of a dried up old drunk.

Commonsense said...

Wow someone is spinning fantasies. Either Reich or Roger.

If it's Reich, Roger is enough of a fool to gobble it up.

Either way he's ridiculous.

Loretta Russo said...

Ho hum.

While they are distracted with crowd size Trump is busy working on defunding murder factory Planned Parenthood and moving the Embassy to Jerusalem. Let them keep worrying about crowd size and cakes.

Loretta Russo said...

"Either way he's ridiculous."

Anyone taking either one of them serious is out of their damn minds.

Loretta Russo said...

"Did you all know that a Working Full Time RN can go on Social Security Disability Insurance and make the same take home. Yes, I learned that today."

They're grifters.

caliphate4vr said...



Don't listen to his words, listen to his heart....KAC as she spins like loretta.....LOL
250 K just in the bowl....donnie the trump
Won in a landslide! Prince Reebus
GW is a hoax Donnie the trump
His Birth certificate is fake....donnie the trump


Is fatty trying to do haiku?

Otherwise that's some nonsensical stoned ass gibberish

caliphate4vr said...

30 million women voted for Trump, the first Tuesday of November. In the USA


Roger and fatty are all bothered about 2 million, worldwide that walk for whatever yesterday.

Myballs said...

Trump won white women by six points.

That's the real women's movement.

Roger Amick said...

"Alternative facts are not facts. They are falsehoods," Chuck Todd tells President Trump's counselor Kellyanne Conway on Meet the Press this morning

READ MORE: http://nbcnews.to/2kfdyWT

She is a liar and you don't care.

You are victims of a physiological disorder.

Gaslighting is a form of psychological abuse used by narcissists in order to instill in their victim’s an extreme sense of anxiety and confusion to the point where they no longer trust their own memory, perception or judgment. The techniques used in “Gaslighting” by the narcissist are similar to those used in brainwashing, interrogation, and torture that have been used in psychological warfare by intelligence operative, law enforcement and other forces for decades.

Trump installs extreme anxiety to the point where you are unable to have perception or judgment. You have been brainwashed to the point where you can't accept reality.

Loretta Russo said...

"Roger and fatty are all bothered about 2 million, worldwide that walk for whatever yesterday."

A drunk and a crack head - spit.

Roger Amick said...

Wait and see, twit.

Roger Amick said...

wp, I heard today, the two pictures were taken from the same location on the Washington Monument.

Roger Amick said...

Even Fox news pushed back on the#trumplies.
Chris Wallace similarly challenged Priebus on “Fox News Sunday.” Wallace said Trump had made statements that were “flat wrong” and that there needed to be discussion about “the president’s honesty.” Wallace showed photos of the crowd at Barack Obama’s first inauguration and compared the number of attendees to the crowd gathered at Trump’s. There’s no question that fewer people attended this year.


FOX NEWS SUNDAY
“I was there on the Mall. ... I am telling you, there were huge empty areas,” Wallace said, saying he saw the difference with his own eyes.

The Sunday show hosts acknowledged that there’s a legitimate debate to be had about whether crowd sizes matter. But the point is that the Trump administration, and the president himself, lied about a matter that was easily verifiable.

Trump made his comments during a visit to the CIA, while standing in front of the agency’s Memorial Wall of heroes. In addition to boasting about how many people attended his inauguration, he talked about the number of times he’s been on magazine covers, called the media “the most dishonest human beings on earth” and accused the press of concocting a feud between him and the CIA.

The media did not make up that feud. Trump himself has compared the intelligence community to Nazis.

rrb said...

The superstate is under the control of a privileged elite of the Inner Party, that persecutes individualism and independent thinking as "thoughtcrime".[3]
________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________


now that you mention it, trump does need to clean house at the IRS ASAP.



rrb said...

Trump installs extreme anxiety to the point where you are unable to have perception or judgment.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

i'm glad you think so.

#thisishowyougotTrump

opie said...


now that you mention it, trump does need to clean house at the IRS ASAP.

He needs to start with his family members and the nut cracker alternate facts lady. LOL

opie said...

Loretta Russo said...
"Roger and fatty are all bothered about 2 million, worldwide that walk for whatever yesterday."

A drunk and a crack head - spit.

Spit? I can't figure out which post is dumber, but I think Pauline, once again trying to act manly by name calling wins for his constitant idiotic posts with loretta coming in a close second for lack of imagination. LOL Millions don't matter, just ask trump......

opie said...

Is fatty trying to do haiku?

Trying to act like an intellect, Pauline? You are from georgia and intellect is not one of your states strong suits. LOL

Loretta Russo said...

Go fuck yourself crack head.