Thursday, December 3, 2020

Allegations of election fraud becoming less specific and more general...

This is counterintuitive and reeks of desperation

Yesterday the President gave a speech which he called one of the most important speeches of his Presidency. The speech laid out what he sees as the issues with the 2020 election and to some degree problems with our election system in general. Now I think something like this could have been an effective use of the podium, if the focus was more on improving elections in general and less about 2020 and how it affected Trump himself.

It's extremely hard to tell if the President is still actually legitimately fighting this election in his own mind, or if he is given up and is just sort of releasing his frustrations. There are generally mixed signals going on in regards to the intent. But the less the President makes this about election integrity (which is a good argument) and the more he makes it about himself somehow pulling a rabbit out of the legal hat (chances of which are the classic slim and none, with slim being seen leaving the building), the less people will take heed and the more people will dismiss it. 

Perhaps the President is serious about making another run in 2024. I am not sure who could really challenge him within the Republican ranks. Certainly if Biden is not able to pick up the pieces of the post Covid reality, then the Republican could very well be a favorite in 2024. We have to remember that Trump still garnered eleven million more votes than in 2016, and was within 0.4, 0.4, and 0.2 percent in three states that would garnered him an electoral college victory. 

But to really position himself, he needs to draw the fine line between looking like a fighter who will exhaust his last legitimate means to contest, and looking like a guy who doesn't want to accept that he lost. I mean there is a fine line between fierce competitor and bad loser. Now granted, Trump passed that line for some by not conceding "before" the election. But he has also passed that line for many other reasonable Americans, and his actions grow increasingly hard to justify for even his most avid fans. 

To overturn an entire state would require very specific proof of election fraud that involved more votes that the winner won by. There is very little time to litigate, so you need much of your evidence up front. While this might not seem fair, it is what is is and it is the rules you must play by. There was a time early on when there appeared to be some specific evidence of fraud, but we have seemed to move beyond the specific (likely because it's hard to prove) and into the more generic concepts of the unconstitutional nature of mail in ballots and other temporary changes to election procedures. 

While I don't entirely discount that there are constitutional issues with Governors signing executive orders that alter election laws (because those are strictly against the constitution).  Mass mailings of ballots to people who didn't request them. Allowing for longer periods of time to accept ballots which seemed well out of line with any normal postal delivery need. Executive orders that rescinded the need for signature matches and other issues of security written into state laws. Much of this was done using Covid as cover. But if someone can tell me why Covid would have anything to do with signing a ballot or someone matching a signature, then you are way smarter than I. 

But the time to litigate that was back when the orders were signed. Many were. These were obvious constitutional issues and even more obvious bending of rules and laws that had nothing to do with Covid. I would offer that if not for the feckless nature of the Chief Justice who allowed many things to stand on a 4-4 basis, that the court could have prevented much of the nonsense we are going through right now. No question that many of these actions would not have passed muster had we had the full court we have today.

But now is not the time to relitigate. It's one thing to try to prevent a state from mailing out ballots to everyone and provide them with less stringent rules of security. It's quite another to invalidate those votes and voters after they have followed those rules that you couldn't stop the first time around. Honestly,  it's simply not in Trump's best interest or the best interest of the country to do so.

I have no issues with questioning this election. There are obvious issues in plain sight to anyone willing to see them. But perhaps the better option is to use what we learned and try to make changes to things moving forward. After 2016, Congress passed laws that made it more difficult for social media and others to accept revenue for election ads that ultimately came from foreign sources. We should take an even harder look at what went wrong in 2020, and pass some new laws that will help prevent the widespread problems we saw in this election. 

After all... election integrity is something everyone should want.

102 comments:

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Even Lyndsey Graham said that he needed more than a video.

Another Republican house member said shutdown the Twitter feed.

Finally you have quit questioning the veracity of the election.

Fixing the election system will be a major issue, after we get the vaccine distributed and reopen the economy.

We will probably differ on social media right and reform.

I take a libertarian approach on the social media companies because the first amendment is the first amendment for a reason.

This President has assault election integrity because he thinks about himself only . So make sure that you think for yourself.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Covid would have anything to do with signing a ballot or someone matching a signature, then you are way smarter than I. 

Actually. If you signed up as a voter, 20 years before you vote by mail, your signature can be greatly different. I know that my signature is very different than it was 20 years ago. I have some signatures from my high school era!

I still sign my first name, middle initial and last name.

Anonymous said...


After all... election integrity is something everyone should want.


old and busted: election integrity

new hotness: win by any means necessary; lie cheat steal.

in terms of election integrity, we are fucked. no amount of our side playing by the rules can possibly overcome democrat corruption. in retrospect, this election was lost the day it was announced mail-in ballots would be allowed. and then when states like PA said no postmark & no signature was required was when i knew that we were REALLY fucked.

democrats are a criminal enterprise masquerading as a political party. the MSM are their enforcers.

one must reconcile ones self to acknowledging this before any meaningful attempt at reform can begin.

or simply accept the fact that you will lose elections until the end of time. democrats treat politics as blood sport & scorched earth. the GOP chooses to remain polite and genteel; acting as a valet for the left. this is a path to the destruction of the Republic. we've "elected" a dementia patient with a streetwalking whore as his back up for chrissakes.

wtf.








C.H. Truth said...

I take a libertarian approach

The Libertarian approach?

This is a simple question.

Do we believe that the First Amendment provides the power to the Government or Big Business to make a determination as to who can say what?

or

Do we believe that the First Amendment provides free speech to any and all individual Americans, without being censored by Government or Big Business.


All libertarians believe that the power is with the Individual American and that the First Amendment is specifically designed to "prevent" free speech from being censored by the Government or Big Business.


Your approach - which is to give the power of who can say what to the Government or Big Business is quite literally fascism.

Anonymous said...



I take a libertarian approach on the social media companies because the first amendment is the first amendment for a reason.


i'll assume you have no idea what a libertarian is, because if you did you'd be aghast at the abuse fully half of Americans are suffering at the hands of big tech and the social media giants, and you'd want sec. 230 (NOT 320) repealed YESTERDAY.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Businesses can determine what they want to broadcast or publish in any method.

The first amendment granted them the right to choose what they want to say because they are private companies, not government entities .

Anonymous said...



you were saying about election integrity?

Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger has launched investigations into several groups, including one founded by former Georgia gubernatorial candidate Stacey Abrams, for seeking to “aggressively” register “ineligible, out-of-state, or deceased voters” before the state’s Jan. 5 Senate runoff elections.

Raffensperger’s office on Wednesday said the investigations are into groups including America Votes, Vote Forward and The New Georgia Project — which was founded by Abrams and previously chaired by Democratic Senate candidate Raphael Warnock.

Raffensperger for weeks has issued warnings against efforts to register individuals who are ineligible to vote in Georgia’s runoff elections or to encourage people to come to Georgia with the sole purpose of casting ballots.

“I have issued clear warnings several times to groups and individuals working to undermine the integrity of elections in Georgia through false and fraudulent registrations,” Raffensperger said in a statement Wednesday. “The security of Georgia’s elections is of the utmost importance.”

Raffensperger said Wednesday that his office has “received specific evidence that these groups have solicited voter registrations from ineligible individuals who have passed away or live out of state.”

“I will investigate these claims thoroughly and take action against anyone attempting to undermine our elections,” he vowed.



https://www.foxnews.com/politics/voter-group-founded-by-stacey-abrams-under-investigation-seeking-out-of-state-dead

and someone needs to drive that gap-toothed, lard-assed, piece of shit out of polite society.



Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Do we believe that the First Amendment provides free speech to any and all individual Americans, without being censored by Government yes.


or Big Business. No, because they are free companies. They are not the government.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Business don't have to authority to investigate, charge and convit and imprison them. The government does.

Anonymous said...

Blogger Roger Amick said...

Businesses can determine what they want to broadcast or publish in any method.

The first amendment granted them the right to choose what they want to say because they are private companies, not government entities .



so, you really want to lose this debate for the umpteenth time, alky?

btw... we've seen the NY Times, the WaPo, and CNN get sued, and LOSE, in a civil suit.

sec. 230 protection, if they had it, would've protected them from civil litigation. and Nick Sandman would not have gotten rich at their expense.

and it's not like the WaPo refused to print the kid's letter to the editor. it's that they chose to knowingly and willfully LIE about him.



that's how this works alky.

Caliphate4vr said...

The first amendment granted them the right to choose what they want to say because they are private companies,

Stupid why did Sandmann win against CNN?

Caliphate4vr said...

He still won’t get it

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Scott, governments and private companies have different rights. Imo

If it gets to the Supreme Court, I suspect that my argument will prevail.

Anonymous said...

Blogger Roger Amick said...

Businesses can determine what they want to broadcast or publish in any method.


check into libel and slander laws and get back to us, m'kay alky?

oh and btw...

Sarah Palin can sue New York Times for defamation: court ruling


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-new-york-times-palin-idUSKBN25O31D

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

I won't argue with the racist rodent bastard or Cali because they don't have the ability to think

Anonymous said...

Anonymous Caliphate4vr said...

He still won’t get it



but he'll post his bullshit in BOLD cali!

LOL.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Libel is a civil case, not a government assault on free speech.

Anonymous said...



Blogger Roger Amick said...

Libel is a civil case, not a government assault on free speech.



dumbass...

sec. 230 (NOT 320), provides protection against CIVIL LIABILITY.

that's the point of this whole fucking exercise.



Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

I have the right file a civil suit against rrb for false accusations.

But I can't file criminal charges against him.

Caliphate4vr said...

Hey genius I’m still trying to find the Secretary of Justice

Yeah you’re smart

C.H. Truth said...

If it gets to the Supreme Court, I suspect that my argument will prevail

Literally because you don't understand Section 230 exemptions and that Twitter (is a company that doesn't publish anything).

Your internet provider is a private company. Can they determine what websites you should be allowed to go to, block information that they prefer you not see, and block your access to anyplace where you might be able to use their service to provide your opinion?

Should the internet provider be able to change your access, block your access, and otherwise stop you from interacting... because they are run by the Koch brothers and don't like your politics?


Because that is what you are advocating Roger.

That because I own the internet company I have the basic fundamental right to control all speech provided within it.

Whether it is the Government (who can arrest you) or the Internet company (who can shut off your access) - neither has ever been granted the "right" to censor free speech under the guise that because they "own" the means or the forum, that they get to choose what is said.

C.H. Truth said...

So I will wait to here from you Roger...

The same questions would apply to your phone service.

Should sprint or AT&T or T-Mobile be allowed to monitor your conversations and then shut off your phone if they don't like a political discussion you might be having with your friend or relative?

Because those providers "own" those networks that your phone relies on.


Is that "really" your position?

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Section 230 prevents the social media companies from civil charges.

The court ruled against the plaintiffs.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

That's a different approach. A private conversation is absolutely protected by the first amendment.

If AT%T were listening in, they can be sued, 230 doesn't protect them.

Honest, decent, truthful Rev. said...

Trump Hits Barr for Dismissing Voter Fraud
12:40 pm
“President Trump said Thursday he is disappointed in Attorney General Bill Barr for saying that the Justice Department had no uncovered evidence of widespread fraud in the 2020 election,” The Hill reports.

Said Trump: “He hasn’t done anything, so he hasn’t looked. When he looks he’ll see the kind of evidence that right now you are seeing in the Georgia senate. They are going through hearings right now in Georgia and they are finding tremendous volumes. So, they haven’t looked very hard. Which is a disappointment, to be honest with you, because it’s massive fraud.”
____________

Take your evidence for "tremendous volumes" of "massive fraud" into court, sport.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

There is a difference between private conversations and public information.

Scott, seriously you know better

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Scott, private phone calls are protected by the first amendment. If the police want to wiretap your phone number, they need a warrant.

Anonymous said...

Why do some people dislike Donald Trump?
I not only dislike him as a “politician” but also as a person. He will go down in history as one of the worst leaders this nation has ever seen because of these reasons.

Just a heads up, I’m being blunt in my answer and there will be explicit language in this answer.

He claims to be a “self-made genius” but in reality he was born with a silver spoon up his ass. His paternal grandfather, Frederick Trump, was a German immigrant who became immensely wealthy by operating restaurants and boarding houses in Seattle and the Yukon during the Canadian gold rush and this wealth was passed down to his son, Fred Trump, which was passed down to Donald J. Trump through several trust funds set up by his father and paternal grandmother. His business career was jump started by a very generous “small loan” of $1,000,000. Donald Trump is no Bill Gates or Steve Jobs, but the beneficiary of coming from a wealthy family.

He’s a fraud. Donald Trump has bullshitted just about everybody in this country, including his most ardent supporters. Trump University is one of the biggest scams ever created, He claims to want to help those that live in coal country and economically depressed Midwestern industrial cities, yet his trade wars hurt those people the most. Donald Trump is a very successful con-man who has found himself in the most powerful position in the world which should worry everybody.

He enables racists along with being one himself. He never called out the far-right demonstrators in Charlottesville, Virginia until media pressure forced him to, with Trump saying that there were “good people on both sides.” Is it any surprise that there is an increase in alt-right and Neo-Nazi activity under this presidency? Trump normalizes these views and allows fringe groups like the alt-right and the National Socialist movement to openly harass and harm people. He also been accused of referring to Omarosa Manigault Newman as a “nigger.” Let’s not forget that he also referred to Mexicans as “rapists.”

He’s sexist and mysogynistic. He has repeatedly sexually and verbally harassed women, he’s cheated on his numerous wives with multiple women and of course, Stormy Daniels, he constantly demeans female politicians, there’s the infamous tape of him and Billy Bush being horny douchebags, and much more.

He doesn’t care about average Americans like you and me. His policies hurt your everyday American. His tax-cuts only benefit the wealthy, with the middle and lower classes getting almost none of the tax cut with 99% of it going to the top income bracket. He wants to take away the healthcare of millions of Americans along with the fact that his trade wars hurt the American business and consumer. I fear that the US will be even more of an oligarchic state than it already is.

Caliphate4vr said...

Are being this obtuse intentionally, Alky? It’s coming to you naturally isn’t it?

Honest, decent, truthful Rev. said...

He is ignorant of environmental issues. Trump in power simply reinforces the stereotype that most Republicans are ignorant of science. He has opened up American coasts to extractive drilling, his Secretary of the Interior, Ryan Zinke, has opened up federally protected land to oil, gas, and mineral extraction, Trump has also had the US leave the Paris Accords, and his ex-EPA chief, Scott Pruitt, spent most of his career fighting against environmental protections, which makes no fucking sense for the EPA chief.

He is an asshole to other leaders and their respective countries unless it’s Putin and Kim-Jong-un. Since when the fuck has Canada out of all countries been a security threat? Since when have we considered the European Union to be foes? Our relationships with our allies has never been perfect or conflict free, but we respected each other and held each other to high standard. Trump and his supporters are acting all mystified on why people in foreign nations might not be too pleased with the United States right now given his disastrous foreign policy. I’m not against “America First” but not at the expense of ruining decades of friendship and hard work and screwing over our allies who have been there for us when we needed them. Just imagine if one of your good friends started insulting you and distancing him or herself from you and that’s exactly what Trump is doing to our allies.

He’s a flip-flopper. Trump actually used to be quite liberal according to previous interviews with Trump himself stating that he wasn’t particularly religious, is fine with gay marriage, and considered himself pro-choice.
Now, Trump considers himself a right-wing populist because he’s a con-man and he was able to stroke nativist fears that have been rising in the developed world. He has no set of values or morals that he sticks to, which makes him an opportunist who is only in it for himself.

His immigration policy is inhumane and flawed. You have to be a special kind of asshole to be willing to deport kids and teens protected under DACA which 90% of Americans support. He also has given praise to Joe Arpaio who racially profiled, mistreated inmates, failed to report sex crimes, and unlawful enforcement of immigration laws. His border wall will be one of the biggest wastes of taxpayer dollars in history. If you don’t want illegal immigrants coming here then eliminate incentives for them to come here by penalizing employers and industries that hire large amounts of illegals and develop an immigration system that values merit.

He blames all of the problems of the US on Obama and the liberals. He likes to claim that he is the messiah of the American economy, yet he is riding on Obama’s coattails who rescued this economy from the 2007 recession. Thanks to Obama our economy stabilized and didn’t end up like those of Spain, Italy, or Greece who all have unemployment rates of 10% or more.

As a final point I would like to say that it’s not just “some” people who dislike Trump. It’s most Americans with 60% or more of us disapproving of him and Trump is almost universally disliked in the rest of the developed world.

Anonymous said...



alky...

twitter is a social media messaging platform.

AT&T and the other wireless carries are, among other things, voice and text messaging platforms.

if i send a tweet that @jack doesn't like, he can disable my account. he should be open to civil liability for doing so. if AT&T we're to suspend my service for a text they disagreed with it would be the same fucking thing.

once again, you could not be more wrong, and once again you double down on invincible ignorance.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Should the internet provider be able to change your access, block your access, and otherwise stop you from interacting... because they are run by the Koch brothers and don't like your politics?


Because that is what you are advocating Roger.


Yes! Google or Twitter or Facebook have the authority to determine whether they want to broadcast.

But the internet provides the absolute right to post what you want on your own ,com ,org page that you can start in one day!

C.H. Truth said...

Roger...

You do realize that Facebook, Twitter, Blogger, AT&T, Spectrum, etc... are all treated the same way by the laws regarding this. All of them are considered to be providers. They all provide people a means to communicate. There are some situations where they are allowed to monitor or even block activity. Those are generally explained when you sign up for service.

When you sign up for Facebook, Blogger, or Twitter... you agree to the rules. For Blogger I am allowed to post most anything, but illegal things. If I want to post porn or nudity in certain forms I am required to mark the site as a porn site. You can also review the terms for twitter or facebook that will provide that you cannot break the law, cannot post violence, promote violence, etc. You probably have to be careful with nudity (although there are sexual sites even on Facebook).

But whether it is Blogger, Facebook, or Twitter... you are becoming the publisher and you (not the provider) are responsible for what you post.

You can search these sites over and not find a thing in their terms that would suggest they can monitor and censor based on political or social leanings. The reason is that doing so would be considered illegal and if they chose to monitor and make decisions, then they become the "publisher" and lose their 230 protections.



The NYT, WaPo, etc... are all "publishers". Meaning they get to pick and choose what is and is not printed or stated on their platforms. But they are also held responsible for things that are printed.

They are not protected.


I feel like this goes in one ear and out the other... not because you are not capable of understanding. But because you are obstinate and stubborn about demanding you are right (when you are clearly wrong).

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

I'm not a lawyer but I understand the law better than you.

When you can't comprehend what I say, you insult me

Honest, decent, truthful Rev. said...

You guys are discussing hair splitting nonentities while the more important stuff is going on.

Democrats Hold Edge In Georgia Runoffs
10:18 am

A new SurveyUSA poll in Georgia finds Jon Ossoff (D) leading Sen. David Perdue (R) in their U.S. Senate runoff, 50% to 48%.

In the other U.S. Senate runoff, Raphael Warnock (D) leads Sen. Kelly Loeffler (R), 52% to 45%.

Honest, decent, truthful Rev. said...

Zum Beispiel:
(For example):

Wisconsin High Court Won’t Hear Trump Case
1:10 pm
The Wisconsin Supreme Court won’t hear President Trump’s election lawsuit, likely dooming state court case seeking to overturn loss, the AP reports.

However, the Wisconsin State Journal reports Trump filed his second lawsuit challenging Wisconsin’s election results, this time in federal court.

C.H. Truth said...

More to the point Roger...

You are making an argument that nobody is actually making. Liberal politicians are not arguing that Twitter has the "right to monitor and censor" because they are publishers or a private company.

Twitter themselves are also not making that argument.

The argument being made, is that as an extension to allowable use of blocking (such as advocating violence, advocating law breaking, posting child porn, etc...) that they can "fact check" or otherwise block materials deemed "dangerous" that are judged on standards that they "claim" are not political...

because again Roger... even Twitter acknowledges that they have no right to censor based on politics or social agenda.

But they are attempting to expand the line to where they can "claim" that blocking certain viewpoints are akin to blocking "dangerous" activity.



I think I would be perfectly fine with Twitter coming out of the closet and making themselves a publisher just like the NYT. They could openly state that they will censor based on politics and social agenda and lose half of their users to Parlor and other forums.

Then they will be continuously sued from anyone and everyone who is harmed by what people post there.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Scott, the first amendment is not absolute.

Porn and child abuse can be censored by the private companies. They can't prosecute them for crimes

You are trying to draw similarities between porn and politics.

Porn and child abuse is not protected by the first amendment.

Political differences are projected by the first amendment.

So, yes the private companies can be required by the government to censor child abuse etc..

But the government should not have the authority to require that they carry everything else.

C.H. Truth said...

I'm not a lawyer but I understand the law better than you.

And you apparently believe you understand the law better than the attorneys for Twitter and Facebook, as well as pretty much every member of Congress who has been debating these subjects.


Nobody (but our resident law genius nursing home medicated old timer) actually is arguing that Twitter has the "first amendment right" to censor based on politics.

C.H. Truth said...

Seriously Reverend?


After the humiliation that pollsters suffered "again" in 2020... you are back to this nonsense? According to the pollsters, Collins lost, Tillis lost, Ernst was going to lose, and even McConnell and Graham were "in trouble".

Oh yeah.... and how many times, Reverend... did you gleefully and stupidly tell us all that Texas was in play because of "polling". Turns out Trump won Texas by around six points and Cornyn won by nearly ten.

C.H. Truth said...

Apparently Twitter should hire Roger...

Since he is waaaaaayyyyyy smarter than all the lawyers they have!!!

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Scott, I have come to my conclusions by myself. I know that Twitter etc. are not making the same argument, that outside of porn etc.

But I believe that they have the same rights reserved to publishers.

If they can be sued by people accusing them of censorship. I think it would weaken first amendment rights.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

LMAO.

Scott, I have come to my conclusions by myself. I know that Twitter etc. are not making the same argument, that outside of porn etc.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

I should have been a lawyer lol

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Breaking news


MADISON, Wis. (AP) - The Wisconsin Supreme Court on Thursday refused to hear President Donald Trump's lawsuit attempting to overturn his loss to Democrat Joe Biden in the battleground state, saying the case must first wind its way through lower courts.

The legal defeat was the latest in a string of losses for Trump's post-election lawsuits. Judges in multiple battleground states have rejected his claims of fraud or irregularities.



Anonymous said...



But I believe that they have the same rights reserved to publishers.

If they can be sued by people accusing them of censorship. I think it would weaken first amendment rights.


if they were willing to leave well enough alone, they would be fine. but when they choose to censor (READ: EDIT) they become publishers, genius. and should enjoy the rights reserved to publishers. which means surrendering their sec. 230 protections.

that's what you're missing genius. they want to act as publishers while maintaining they're not; that they're platforms, and therefore retain those precious sec. 230 protections.

your interpretation of this topic is so flawed, so stupid, so fucking imbecilic, it's absolutely staggering.



C.H. Truth said...

I should have been a lawyer lol

So Roger is "actually" "literally" saying that he is smarter than all of the attorneys from Twitter, Facebook, and of course smarter than all of the Judges and what not who have ruled on these issues.

I mean it's one thing to horribly lose a debate about statistics with someone who has a math degree and works in data analysis and claim to be smarter and better informed anyways...

But to actually believe that everyone within the legal system is wrong about Social Media and he IS actually the only one who is right...

Is a sign of what exactly?

I'll let everyone decide for themselves.



And to be clear Roger... I don't believe that you actually knew that Twitter and Facebook were not making the same argument you were. I think you actually thought you were arguing the liberal conventional wisdom line against the conservative conventional wisdom line... and then somewhere along the lines figured out that you were wrong and are now trying to cover it up.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

(2)Civil liabilityNo provider or user of an interactive computer service shall be held liable on account of—

(A)

any action voluntarily taken in good faith to restrict access to or availability of material that the provider or user considers to be obscene, lewd, lascivious, filthy, excessively violent, harassing, or otherwise objectionable, whether or not such material is constitutionally protected; or

(B)

any action taken to enable or make available to information content providers or others the technical means to restrict access to material described in paragraph (1).[1]

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

I'm not admitting I am wrong, nor am I trying to cover it up.

I know that since I didn't research into precident.

If I find out that my assumption are incorrect I will admit failure.

But I am standing behind my conclusion on the absolute right of the private companies to determine what they want to broadcast except porn etc..

Anonymous said...



oh lookie.

alky posted the statute. he thinks it makes him look smart.

ok alky, now please tell us why twitter, facebook, et. al. are scared shitless of losing sec. 230 protections.

can you? i'll give you a hint... it's not about this: "whether or not such material is constitutionally protected"


c'mon man!*

show us what kind of nursing home lawyer you are.



*h/t: slow joe.

C.H. Truth said...

any action voluntarily taken in good faith to restrict access to or availability of material that the provider or user considers to be obscene, lewd, lascivious, filthy, excessively violent, harassing, or otherwise objectionable, whether or not such material is constitutionally protected; or

Sure... which is why a provider can allow subscribers to put on restrictions or child modes (which block content). A provider can also choose not to allow certain types of porn (even if that porn is technically protected).


But what this law does not state is that the provider is allowed to choose to block content because they don't like the politics or the social nature of it. There are clear lines which will always prevent any type of provider from blocking a news channel simply because they don't like the political spin provided.



What a great lawyer you would have made Roger!

Bringing up evidence that proves you wrong!

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Scott, why aren't speaking out loud about General Flynn calling for martial law?

Of the lawyer calling for the assassination of the guy who said that the election was the most secure ever?


Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

I posted it even though I didn't agree it

Anonymous said...

Blogger Roger Amick said...

Scott, why aren't speaking out loud about General Flynn calling for martial law?


well, in Flynn's case i can see where he's coming from considering the royally devastating fucking0linsky and the FBI threw into him. they tried to ruin the man. for NOTHING. it's the hyperbolic rhetoric of a man you guys tried to DESTROY, alky


Of the lawyer calling for the assassination of the guy who said that the election was the most secure ever?

digenova didn't say he wanted the guy assassinated alky. that's a lie. he said he should be shot or drawn and quartered for being a piece of shit and sucking at the job he was paid to do.

more hyperbolic rhetoric. rhetoric i've used myself, saying "that guy should be shot!"

context, dumbass. context. it's not like he was calling on a bernie bro like james hodgekinson to take up arms and actually shoot him.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

I found this, but I still think that the social media companies have the same rights as the publishers.

Zuckerberg admitted that social media platforms "have responsibilities, and it may make sense for there to be liability for some of the content that is on the platform." But he also said that social media platforms are not news publishers and therefore they still require some protections under the law. 

They should have the same rights as publishers

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Ignorant troll squad asshole

Anonymous said...


They should have the same rights as publishers

then we're in agreement. facebook, twitter, et. al. deserve to LOSE any and all sec. 230 protections.


Caliphate4vr said...

They should have the same rights as publishers

Geezis

Not platforms

C.H. Truth said...

Zuckerberg admitted that social media platforms "have responsibilities, and it may make sense for there to be liability for some of the content that is on the platform." But he also said that social media platforms are not news publishers and therefore they still require some protections under the law.

Well Roger... Zuckerberg is obviously stupid like me. You are a much better lawyer than anyone he has working for him and are way smarter too.

But isn't it funny how Zuckerberg is looking to play both sides of this argument? He wants the protection of not being a "publisher" but he pretends that the censorship that they are incorporating is out of some sort of "responsibility".

The question is who is he being "responsible" to here and where should his loyalties be? Should he be looking out for the individual Twitter users who are the ones driving his bottom line and the ones using the service? Or is he wanting his loyalties to be with the social justice warriors who want to "cancel" everything they disagree with?


The law and the constitution provides that his responsibilities (as a platform and not a publisher) is to look out for the First Amendment Rights of those who use his service. There is no legal or constitutional "responsibility" to protect the cancel culture social justice warriors from having to view anything they don't want to see, and there is no legal or constitutional responsibility for him to "fact check" anyone, especially when the "factchecking" is not really "factual" most of the time.

C.H. Truth said...

What would be really really simple here for everyone...

Is that if Twitter went "back" to the way they were when most of us joined them. It would be really simple:

Not ban people for how they look to build their followers.
Not put people on restriction for political views
Not ban people for political views.
Not put political information behind dangerous status.
Not put a bunch of disclaimers on content.

The reality if that if you were to put "this claim has been disputed" on everything that has been disputed, then literally every political claim made by pretty much anyone could qualify as being disputed.

I say we should cut taxes because it will spur the economy?
* This claim has been disputed

No, you argue. We should raise taxes to raise money for government stimulus. That will spur the economy.
* This claim has been disputed

That doesn't work. Try cutting capital gains!
* This claim has been disputed

Well capital gains cut's don't work. Let's create more Government Jobs
* This claim has been disputed


etc.. etc...

it would be silly, but also the most truthful manner in which Twitter would have to use their "disputed" message.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Regions of California where hospitals are in danger of overload will be subject to a new stay-at-home order, with some parts of the state projected to reach that point later this week, Gov. Gavin Newsom announced Thursday.

The new order will apply in regions where available intensive care unit capacity drops below 15%, according to the Newsom administration.

Newsom said four out of five regions in the state, including the Greater Sacramento Region, are on track to hit that threshold early this month. The fifth region, the Bay Area, is on track to meet that threshold by the middle of the month.

“The bottom line is if we don’t act now, our hospital system will be overwhelmed,” Newsom said at a press conference announcing the new stay-at-home order.

The new rules group California counties into the following five regions:

Greater Sacramento: Alpine, Amador, Butte, Colusa, El Dorado, Nevada, Placer, Plumas, Sacramento, Sierra, Sutter, Yolo, YubaSan Joaquin Valley: Calaveras, Fresno, Kern, Kings, Madera, Mariposa, Merced, San Benito, San Joaquin, Stanislaus, Tulare, TuolumneNorthern California: Del Norte, Glenn, Humboldt, Lake, Lassen, Mendocino, Modoc, Shasta, Siskiyou, Tehama, TrinityBay Area: Alameda, Contra Costa, Marin, Monterey, Napa, San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Clara, Santa Cruz, Solano, SonomaSouthern California: Imperial, Inyo, Los Angeles, Mono, Orange, Riverside, San Bernardino, San Diego, San Luis Obispo, Santa Barbara, Ventura

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

We agree to disagree.

If it gets to the Supreme Court hearing, I have no idea what they will say.

It depends upon how it is presented.

As this moves forward, we will see!

I actually understand your points.

Anonymous said...

Are you impacted Roger?

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

No

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

This makes my point

The Trump administration is suing Facebook over allegations that the tech giant discriminated against U.S. workers by creating recruitment processes that favored temporary visa holders, according to a complaint filed by the Department of Justice (DOJ) Thursday.

The complaint alleges that Facebook created a separate hiring process for certain temporary immigration status holders, such as H-1B visa holders, and alleges Facebook did not consider U.S. workers for more than 2,600 positions with an average salary of about $156,000.

The complaint is the Trump administration's latest action targeting a big tech company.

It follows a nearly two-year investigation and targets hiring practices between Jan. 1, 2018 and Sept. 18, 2019.


Caliphate4vr said...

How did Covid REALLY spread around the world? New damning test results that show antibodies were in US in December - WEEKS before China raised the alarm - add to growing global evidence of a cover-up

A new study that found traces of coronavirus in US blood samples from December last year is adding to the growing evidence that the virus was circulating for months before China announced its existence, casting more shadows over the truth about the pandemic and fuelling suspicions of a cover-up by Beijing.

Claims the global outbreak began in a livestock market in Wuhan last winter have crumbled in the face of scientific evidence proving the virus was all over the Western world weeks and even months before China declared the first cases to the World Health Organization on December 31.

Research published on Monday revealed that 39 blood samples taken between December 13 and 16 last year in California, Oregon and Washington state had tested positive for Covid antibodies, meaning the people who gave them had been infected weeks earlier.

The evidence is the earliest trace so far of the virus on US soil, and a further 67 samples from between December 30 and January 17 tested positive in Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, Michigan, Rhode Island and Wisconsin.

It adds to a growing body of proof that the virus had spread thousands of miles outside of China long before its existence was acknowledged. Scientists in Italy say they now have proof the virus was there in September 2019, traces of it were found in Brazil in November, a French hospital patient had it in his lungs in December, and the virus was present in sewage in Spain in January.

Anonymous said...

The WTO helped China

Hurting the Rest of the World.

How will biden hold China Accountable?

Anonymous said...



“The bottom line is if we don’t act now, our hospital system will be overwhelmed,” Newsom said at a press conference announcing the new stay-at-home order.


well obviously what this calls for is a mask-less gourmet dinner at the French Laundromat!!!

LOL.

you have an asshat at the helm, alky.

LOL.



Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Doctor Fauci will stay on the Biden administration!

C.H. Truth said...

This makes my point

How so? This is about Facebook hiring employees. What does that have to do with anything we are discussing.

C.H. Truth said...

I wonder how Governor Newsome is going to "act now"?

We literally keep shutting more and more shit down here and things just keep getting worse and worse. Not saying that shutting down is what is causing the issues, but it certainly doesn't seem to help.

Perhaps we should look at this definition of insanity and try something "different" from making everyone stay inside or wearing masks that have effectively been previously proven to not stop the spread of viruses?

Anonymous said...

Blogger Roger Amick said...

This makes my point

The Trump administration is suing Facebook over allegations that the tech giant discriminated against U.S. workers by creating recruitment processes that favored temporary visa holders, according to a complaint filed by the Department of Justice (DOJ) Thursday.



where's the sec. 230 angle, genius?


Anonymous said...



Perhaps we should look at this definition of insanity and try something "different" from making everyone stay inside or wearing masks that have effectively been previously proven to not stop the spread of viruses?

i don't think the shutdowns and edits and mandates have ANYTHING to do with addressing the virus anymore.

these liberal democrat governors and mayors are getting off on this shit. they are drunk on their executive power, and they have absolutely no intention of backing off.

look at what's going on in staten island. it's odd... there's a line running thru staten island with a red zone on one side and a yellow zone on the other. the red zone also happens to vote 'R' while the yellow zone votes 'D."

which side of the line do you think is getting shut down?

these tyrants are going to go too far, someone or a bunch of someone's are going to decide enough is enough, and then someone is going to get hurt. and assholes like newsom and cuomo will stand there like fucking idiots wondering what just happened and why.

Anonymous said...


edits = edicts.

Anonymous said...

Blogger Roger Amick said...

Doctor Fauci will stay on the Biden administration!



LOL. fucking worthless parasite.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Al Capone aka the lame duck President got caught trying to infiltrate the Department of Justice

WASHINGTON (AP) - The official serving as President Donald Trump's eyes and ears at the Justice Department has been banned from the building after trying to pressure staffers to give up sensitive information about election fraud and other matters she could relay to the White House, three people familiar with the matter tell The Associated Press.

Heidi Stirrup, an ally of top Trump adviser Stephen Miller, was quietly installed at the Justice Department as a White House liaison a few months ago. She was told within the last two weeks to vacate the building after top Justice officials learned of her efforts to collect insider information about ongoing cases and the department's work on election fraud, the people said.

Stirrup is accused of approaching staffers in the department demanding they give her information about investigations, including election fraud matters, the people said. They spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to publicly discuss the matter.

The effort came as Trump continues to level baseless claims that he won the election and alleges without evidence that massive voting fraud was responsible for his defeat to President-elect Joe Biden.

Stirrup had also extended job offers to political allies for positions at some of the highest levels of the Justice Department without consulting any senior department officials or the White House counsel's office and also attempted to interfere in the hiring process for career staffers, a violation of the government's human resources policies, one of the people said.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

The Justice Department declined to comment. Attempts to reach Stirrup for comment were not immediately successful.

On Thursday, Trump appointed Stirrup to be a member of the board of visitors of the U.S. Air Force Academy, according to a White House press release.

Earlier this week, Attorney General William Barr told the AP that U.S. attorneys and the FBI had looked into allegations of election irregularities and found no evidence of widespread voting fraud that would change the outcome of the election.


Trump wants Monica Lewinsky style people in the agencies so they can fuck the next administration

Anonymous said...

Blogger Roger Amick said...

This makes my point

The Trump administration is suing Facebook over allegations that the tech giant discriminated against U.S. workers by creating recruitment processes that favored temporary visa holders, according to a complaint filed by the Department of Justice (DOJ) Thursday.



where's the sec. 230 angle, genius?



anonymous said...

LOL. fucking worthless parasite.


SURE DESCRIBES YOU ASSHOLE!!!!!!! Other than being a whinny old white guy....what have you EVER done for the betterment of the country let alone serve it!!!!!! BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!

Anonymous said...

Roger, Good.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Fauci added that it will likely be the first of a series of transition meetings with him. He also said he fully expects to remain in his role as director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases as the new administration takes over.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

President-elect Joe Biden told CNN's Jake Tapper on Thursday that he will ask Americans to wear masks for his first 100 days after he takes office.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

The lame duck President just said.

People in Georgia got caught cold bringing in massive numbers of ballots and putting them in “voting” machines. Great job Brian Kemp!

But he has zero evidence

Caliphate4vr said...

Alky it was presented before the state under oath today, you fucking sot

Caliphate4vr said...

GA Senate subcommittee testimony

Caliphate4vr said...

Where’d you go Rog?

Enjoy the Silence

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Trump Associates Said to Have Been Scrutinized in Suspected Pardon Scheme.

A billionaire from San Francisco sought clemency for a psychologist convicted of monetary crimes. The Republican donor Elliott Broidy and a lawyer for Jared Kushner were enlisted.


The scheme outlined by prosecutors underscores the transactional nature of Mr. Trump’s term, where people leveraged connections to him or framed their causes in terms of his personal or political benefit to influence his decisions.

Mr. Trump has wielded his clemency powers to aid people with personal or political connections to him. He commuted the sentence of Roger J. Stone Jr., his longtime friend and adviser convicted of charges brought by the special counsel, and he pardoned the pro-Trump conservative commentator Dinesh D’Souza and the former Wall Street executive Michael Milken.

And last week, Mr. Trump pardoned his former national security adviser Michael T. Flynn, kicking off what is expected to be a wave of pardons as Mr. Trump’s presidency ends.

Presidents have unchecked authority over clemency, and there is a history of donors or their family members getting pardons. No law bars people from lobbying for pardons, nor is it necessarily illegal to give a donation to a president after receiving a pardon. But bribery laws prohibit explicitly predicating donations or other gifts of value to the granting of a pardon.

Prosecutors contended in the court papers that because the participants in the effort did not register as lobbyists, it could violate both lobbying laws and bribery laws.

The filings unsealed this week by Chief Judge Beryl A. Howell of the United States District Court for the District of Columbia, set off a flurry of intense speculation in Washington and theories involving high-profile convicts.

But the case relates to the conviction of Mr. Baras, 77, who was sentenced in 2014 and ordered to pay restitution of about $594,000 for tax evasion and illegally claiming disability insurance benefits to which he was not entitled from the Social Security Administration.

Mr. Baras fought the conviction for years, suing to vacate, set aside or reduce his sentence. His lawyer sought to appeal up to the Supreme Court, arguing Mr. Baras was deprived of a fair trial partly because the court declined to allow him to present evidence that he made an effort to pay his back taxes and to pay back the improperly received disability benefits. The Supreme Court declined to take the case and Mr. Baras reported to prison in June 2017.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...


At some point during his fight, Mr. Diller took up his cause. He spoke of Mr. Baras having helped him in some way and he felt obliged to return the favor, according to one of Mr. Diller’s sons, Bradley Diller.

“This was his thing,” Bradley Diller said. “I don’t know what the history of his relationship with Hugh Baras was, why he felt this kind of personal obligation, but he was making a kind of huge effort to help out this person.”

While Sanford Diller had trained as a lawyer, he was not practicing and did not appear in court filings as working on Mr. Baras’s behalf.

Bradley Diller said that he did not know about his father’s relationship with Mr. Broidy or Mr. Lowell, and that his father never discussed enlisting their help — or anyone’s — in trying to obtain a pardon for Mr. Baras.

“I doubt my father would do something like that,” he said, adding that, based on their discussions, he believed his father “was just trying to help him on the up and up through legal means.”


Sanford Diller knew Mr. Broidy through Republican Jewish donor circles, according to a person familiar with their relationship. Both donated to conservative and hawkish foreign policy groups, including the Foundation for Defense of Democracies.

While Mr. Diller gave $133,400 to Republican Party committees in 2016, there is no record of a donation from him to Mr. Trump’s campaign. With the exception of $23,400 in donations to Republican Senate candidates in 2014, Mr. Diller did not have a lengthy track record of Republican giving before that.

Mr. Broidy, a California businessman who owns a defense contracting firm based in Virginia, had helped raise money for Mr. Trump’s 2016 campaign, and after the election, he became a top fund-raising official for Mr. Trump’s inauguration and the Republican National Committee, as well as a member of Mr. Trump’s private South Florida club, Mar-a-Lago.


Trump Associates Said to Have Been Scrutinized in Suspected Pardon Scheme https://nyti.ms/2JIrZEY


Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

President Donald Trump is considering preemptively pardoning as many as 20 aides and associates before leaving office, frustrating Republicans who believe offering legal reprieves to his friends and family members could backfire.

Trump’s strategy, like much of his presidency, is nontraditional. He is eschewing the typical protocol of processing cases through the Justice Department. And he may argue that such preemptive pardons for his friends and family members are necessary to spare them from paying millions in legal fees to fight what he describes as witch hunts. Those up for clemency include everyone from Trump’s personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani, to several members of his family — all people who haven’t been charged with a crime. Weighing on Trump’s mind is whether these pardons would look like an admission of guilt.

Republicans, as they often have when Trump appears about to bulldoze through another norm, are expressing some initial hesitation — but they’re not telling him to stop.

“That is in a category that I think you’d probably run into a lot of static,” said Sen. Mike Braun (R-Ind.). “That’s charting new territory, I’m guessing. I don’t think that’s ever been attempted before.”

The result is yet another looming showdown between Trump and the broader Republican Party.

And the potential squabble has taken on added significance as Trump prepares to leave the White House next month. The GOP is grappling with how closely it wants to remain aligned with Trump after his presidency. While the president has turned off voters with his controversial actions — including his past use of the pardon power to spare allies — he retains a loyal following and is mulling a 2024 presidential run. More imminently, Republicans need Trump’s base to turn out in the Jan. 5 Georgia Senate runoff elections, which will decide which party controls the Senate.

GOP senators said Trump would be stepping on political landmines if he grants clemency to his family and associates, even as they noted presidents have broad pardon authority. Sen. Josh Hawley (R-Mo.), a Trump ally and a former state attorney general, acknowledged that such a move by the president would be unprecedented.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

But the clemency would not extend to any state charges, congressional investigations or lawsuits — of which there are plenty.

The New York attorney general and the Manhattan district attorney, for example, have been investigating the Trump Organization for possible financial fraud. D.C. authorities also sued the Trump Organization and Trump’s inaugural committee, alleging the committee misused funds and funneled money back to Trump’s company. Ivanka Trump gave a deposition in that suit earlier this week.

Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.), like other Democrats, has described the possibility of these preemptive parsons as “a gross abuse of the presidential pardon authority.”

The White House did not respond to a request for comment. Neither did representatives for the Trump children and Giuliani.

Some Republicans argued that pardons for Trump or his family would be unnecessary, suggesting the potential moves would simply create problems and be seen as an admission of guilt.




Politico.com.

Caliphate4vr said...

But he has zero evidence

I take it by your responses, I’m right again

LMAO

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Still, Trump is hesitant to pardon any of them, particularly Giuliani, because it may appear that members of his inner circle are criminals, said one of the three people, who spoke to Trump this week. The Giuliani pardon has been discussed more seriously, the person added.

The pardons would be designed to prevent Trump’s allies from being ensnared in any more federal investigations.

Trump Jr. had been investigated for contacts that he had during the 2016 with Russians offering damaging information on his father’s 2016 rival, Hillary Clinton. Later, congressional investigators told the Justice Department that Trump Jr. may have lied to them during their examination of Russia’s 2016 election interference.

Kushner similarly received scrutiny for providing inaccurate information to federal authorities about his contacts with foreigners when he applied for his security clearance.

Neither was charged.


The next administration would not be able to prosecute his family, Giuliani and perhaps himself.

The self pardoning himself has never happen before.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

A judge will laugh out loud and demanding reality universe

Caliphate4vr said...


Blogger Roger Amick said...
A judge will laugh out loud and demanding reality universe


So, then you were wrong

There’s evidence

Man up Alky

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

The constitution grants the President to pardon himself, but article 2 section 3 say "he shall take care that the laws be faithfully executed, and shall commission all the officers of the United States."

Conservative justices believe in original intent, therefore if he tries to pardon himself, the Supreme Court would allow him to be prosecuted for breaking the law, before he was elected, during his term and after his term ended.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

The video seemed to show that after the volunteer observers and reporters were gone, several election workers stayed behind and continued counting votes unobserved until early the next morning, Nov. 4. 

Considering the source of the video, I'm looking forward to see it outside of your alternate reality universe. If they are real,they will show on CNN MSNBC etc.

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Videos are easily fabricated

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

The Republican party is in control of the system in Georgia

You actually believe that the Republicans would allow them to cheat. Because you live in an alternate reality universe!!!!!!

Caliphate4vr said...

Hey stupid it’s now entered into evidence

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

Not in a court. A hearing.

The legislaturs will not vote against the popular vote .

It's fake news robotics

Coldheartedtruth Teller said...

It's not going anywhere else.
Biden will be sworn in on January 20th get used to it and quit drinking tonight