A new study confirms that black men and women are treated differently in the hands of law enforcement. They are more likely to be touched, handcuffed, pushed to the ground or pepper-sprayed by a police officer, even after accounting for how, where and when they encounter the police
But when it comes to the most lethal form of force — police shootings — the study finds no racial bias.
“It is the most surprising result of my career,” said Roland G. Fryer Jr., the author of the study and a professor of economics at Harvard. The study examined more than 1,000 shootings in 10 major police departments, in Texas, Florida and California.
Of course, media coverage and liberal rhetoric does not make something true. In this case, it would appear that there is little evidence to support the rhetoric that White cops are predisposed to shoot at Black suspects. In fact, contrary to popular belief, it may actually be the opposite. White cops may be "less" likely to shoot at a Black suspect. Of course, that seems counter-intuitive. But just because we don't hear about it, doesn't mean that White people are not shot down by the police as well.
The difference is that White people do not march in the street every time it happens White people do not burn down their neighborhoods in protest. White people do not shoot cops for revenge. And most certainly, we do not have a White President telling Americans that Cops are prone to unjustifiably shoot White people.
The truth is that this particular Harvard study should not have come as a surprise to Roland G Freyer Jr. There have been multiple studies on the subject, all suggesting similar results. Even Obama's own Department of Justice did an analysis on the subject that showed White officers less likely than Hispanic and Black officers to shoot at a Black suspect. A Washington State study showed that participants were biased "against" shooting Black suspects, even as they saw Black suspects as generally more dangerous. In fact, is anyone aware of any studies that can positively show that Black suspects are shot more often (all things being equal)?
Police in Houston "less" likely to shoot at at a Black suspect |
The truth is that this particular Harvard study should not have come as a surprise to Roland G Freyer Jr. There have been multiple studies on the subject, all suggesting similar results. Even Obama's own Department of Justice did an analysis on the subject that showed White officers less likely than Hispanic and Black officers to shoot at a Black suspect. A Washington State study showed that participants were biased "against" shooting Black suspects, even as they saw Black suspects as generally more dangerous. In fact, is anyone aware of any studies that can positively show that Black suspects are shot more often (all things being equal)?
President not going to let facts get in the way of good political fodder! |
Reality is that Black people are stopped more often, arrested more often, and generally deal more often with the police. But that is consistent with the fact that Black people commit more crime than other races. Substantially more crime. Moreover, a Police officer is 18.5 times more likely to be killed by a Black suspect than that Police officer is to shoot and kill an unarmed Black suspect.
Lastly, it should be also noted that the higher levels of physical contact between the Police and Black suspects (approximately 20% higher across the board) does not, in and of itself, prove racial bias. We have no way of knowing to what degree an average Black suspect may be more or less cooperative with the Police than other suspects. Certainly with the sort or animosity that the Black community has towards Law enforcement in general, it would not be too hard to generalize a theory that they are simply less cooperative on average than races who don't have the same level of animosity. The concept that the Police are simply "reacting" to the behavior of the suspects cannot be discounted in favor of an assumption of racial bias.
37 comments:
Did he really say it is easier to get a Glock then a book ?
I heard he did , but can't find it.
Unfortunately liberals won't let facts get in the way of a good narrative.
Just look how BLM repeats the chant "Hands up Don't Shoot!!"
Even though evidence conclusively proved Michael Brown never said that.
So the Whitehouse lights up pink for breast cancer, purple for Prince, rainbow for gay marriage, but refuses to light up blue. Meanwhile, he us meeting with BLM leaders today.
Thus is why the country is so angry and divided. He has been antagonizing this and continues to do so.
Jan 2017 can't come soon enough.
Obimbo said he thinks he has played no roll in the current division of this Nation.
He is a complete failure and idiot.
'We Are Not as Divided as We Seem' President dumbass
Well when you took office only 15 percent of Americans worried a lot about Race Relations,,, today 36 percent do (Gallop).
CH proudly states: "...a Police officer is 18.5 times more likely to be killed by a Black suspect than that Police officer is to shoot and kill an unarmed Black suspect."
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What kind of transparently dumb "statistic" is that?
No one is saying that a majority of the police officers in our country are going around mowing down obviously unarmed black people.
Transparently dumb statistic?
“It is the most surprising result of my career,” said Roland G. Fryer Jr., the author of the study and a professor of economics at Harvard. The study examined more than 1,000 shootings in 10 major police departments, in Texas, Florida and California.
The result contradicts the image of police shootings that many Americans hold after the killings (some captured on video) of Michael Brown in Ferguson, Mo.; Tamir Rice in Cleveland; Walter Scott in South Carolina; Alton Sterling in Baton Rouge, La.; and Philando Castile in Minnesota.
Don't like the truth James? Too bad.
James - you show your true colors when the fact that so many cops are killed by Black criminals... only bothers you because it hurts your political narrative.
Just in the news, an unarmed man shot in Fresno for walking towards police with his right hand behind his back. Massively stupid on his part unless he was intent on suicide (possible), but lethal force for simply disobeying a police officer?
There is something terribly wrong with our police force if shootings like this are acceptable or expected. We need to either disarm most of the police officers or somehow ensure that they aren't so fearful as to gun down a man on the mere suspicion of the chance that he might be armed. Or else penalize such behavior to the extent that they fear the punishment.
When the man hides his right hand behind his back and (presumably) walks towards the police officers disobeying their commands.
What exactly is the police suppose to do?
Wait until he shows a gun?
By that time at least one officer would have been shot and possibly killed.
This looks like suicide by cop.
Yes, wait until you see a weapon before you kill him. Is that not the absolute minimum requirement for anyone other than a fascist coward?
Police are allegedly trained an a whole continuum of non-lethal tactics. They are, allegedly, trained in when lethal force is appropriate. This kind of shooting happens is just fear.
Seriously, we're better off without cops at all than with cops that shoot people just for not obeying every instruction.
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-unarmed-teen-shot-fresno-20160628-snap-htmlstory.html
This sounds like suicide by cop or by insanity, but if a person comes toward the cops with one hand behind his back and the cops already have a bead on him, you'd think the cops could wait till a weapon comes into view before shooting. After all, the cops already have him in their sights.
The principle of innocent till proven guilty should apply. An unarmed person is not 'guilty' of being armed until a weapon comes in sight.
Even if some police were to lose their lives due to observing this principle, wouldn't that be preferable to unarmed persons being shot to death? In this case, the man in question may have been suffering from mental illness: "I hate my life."
"... wait until you see a weapon before you kill him. Is that not the absolute minimum requirement...?"
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Should be.
6:57 By the way, Ch, I have no idea what color or race the teenager in that last example was.
WP...
I always believe one thing. If you are willing to go give law enforcement a try yourself... believing you can do better. Than be critical all you want.
If putting your life on the line every day of the job isn't something you are willing to do, then I would offer that your critique is of the armchair variety and really offers no tangible help to the situation.
Cops have probably one of the most difficult jobs in our country. Not all of them are perfect. How many of us know exactly how we would respond in a situation where we had even "some" reason to believe that someone had a gun and were about to shoot you?
If the situation was not cop related, and you as a Private citizen thought that someone might be trying to harm you? At what point do you go ahead and react (either by running away or by fighting back). 99 out of a 100 times, by the time you saw a weapon (such as a gun) it would be way too late.
James- for every example you can come up with... how many perfectly safe, by the books, well trained police stops are there every day in America to offset that?
What would you say?
10,000 to 1?
100,000 to 1?
1,000,000 to 1?
10,000,000 to 1?
Yes, wait until you see a weapon before you kill him. Is that not the absolute minimum requirement for anyone other than a fascist coward?
By the time a police officer sees the weapon the perpetrator would gotten off at least one maybe two shots.
I don't see why we should force our police officers to commit suicide for some ridiculously absurd liberal notion of courage.
But you want to abide but that standard then I invite you to stand in front of a bad guy and wait until he brings his hands around.
If I am standing in front of a bad guy and I have a cocked, ready to fire pistol already aimed at him, and he brings a weapon into view, I think I can get off my shot before he can get his weapon aimed and fired.
I think I am capable of that now, and if I were a policeman specifically trained to do that, I think I could do it even better.
I think I am capable of that now, and if I were a policeman specifically trained to do that, I think I could do it even better.
James would have to wait until he figures out what Bates or Tannenbaum would do before pulling the trigger. People who can't think for themselves, don't make very good cops.
But maybe, by "better" you meant you would be a "better" at being a cop than being a clergy.
If I am standing in front of a bad guy and I have a cocked, ready to fire pistol already aimed at him, and he brings a weapon into view, I think I can get off my shot before he can get his weapon aimed and fired.
And you would be wrong.
Dead wrong.
But James, really. I hope you try to prove me wrong.
I always believe one thing. If you are willing to go give law enforcement a try yourself... believing you can do better. Than be critical all you want.
Baloney! That's the biggest cop-out I've ever heard, to try to deflect criticism of police.
I could have "not shot" that guy. I have "not shot" several guys who squealed their tires and then got out of their pickups. It's not all that hard to not shoot people.
As for the guy "maybe" getting off a few shots, IF he'd actually had a gun and IF he'd decided to have a gun fight, that's probably the second biggest cop-out. Anyone walking down the street can "maybe" get a few shots off. "Maybe" is nowhere near the bar that justifies lethal force. Without knowing - not guessing, not maybe, but knowing - that the person is armed and likely to use it, there is no reasonable belief that either the police officer or the general public is in any danger at all. Let alone the level of danger that justifies lethal force.
WP... your a statistics guy. Like to look at the facts?
In 2015 there were nearly 13 million arrests. Less than 1000 people were fatally shot and only approximately 100 unarmed people were shot by cops. Even within the 100 unarmed shooting, 90% of them were judged to be good shootings.
To put that in perspective about 500 people are struck by Lightning each year...
The reality is that while "you" may believe society would be better off without law enforcement, about 99.99% of the country disagrees with you. In order to have a legitimate law enforcement, you cannot pretend that the criminal suspect has the same rights in a confrontation as the law enforcer. The Law enforcer will always have the right to defend him/her self with lethal force if the criminal suspect threatens them.
If you really want results? You are going to be out of luck trying to change how cops defend themselves. You would be much better off trying to get people to understand that they "do not have" all these made up rights about how they think they can refuse orders, or start a physical confrontation with a cop. A cop has no orders to stand down, or fight fair. He has guns, batons, tasers, etc... and they are used to make sure it's not a fair fight.
Given your opinion (that we don't need cops) is not shared by almost everyone, perhaps you're not the correct person to be judging the police and the manner in which they are trained, and the overall manner in which they are trained to protect themselves.
I think if I were a policeman, I would do better than this.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/08/us/south-carolina-officer-is-charged-with-murder-in-black-mans-death.html?_r=0
I think almost anyone would.
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10:47AM Ch descends to meaningless babble.
But we weren't talking about that case were we?
You're just trying to divert from an argument you've already lost.
James -
I think "I" could do better than this:
http://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20160714/local/pensioner-accused-of-sexually-abusing-his-8-year-old-nephew-and-nieces.618823
You really want to look at a profession where people are involved in shameful acts? You really want to put an end to abuse of Americans? Look at clergy.
I have looked at and condemned clergy in the Roman Catholic church and in every denomination where child abuse has gone on and been covered up -- or has gone on without being covered up.
What does that have to do with the excessive, unnecessary shooting of black citizens?
But you won't condemn clergy of you own faith (or lack thereof)
2:00PM Have you got a screw loose?
I know of three cases in my denomination where pastors broke child abuse laws, and I both condemned their actions and supported the harsh disciplinary and penal measures taken against them by both the state and the denomination.
When it came to this subject you've always Catholic bashed.
You've never condemned members of your own domination until you were called on it.
James - one bad apple spoils the whole bunch... at least as far as your logic?
Out of like 13 million arrests, 10 cops were charged for shooting someone. I think if you can condemn all cops based on that... then we are free to condemn all people within Clergy.
Of course, it would only be liberal of us to assume you to be a child molester (because others are)... and undermine your entire profession (or previous profession).
Or maybe you might find it alarming if someone just went out and shot five random clergy members while they were doing their jobs... In retaliation for what clergy as a whole has done sexually to small children?
Would you see that differently than someone going out and randomly killing 5 cops, because a handful of people are killed by a "bad shooting"?
Did you misread the conditional CHT?
"..that shoot people just for not obeying every instruction."
or did you just pass that buy in your zeal to misrepresent me?
Just how many citizens do you think you can find, that would agree with you that we need cops that will shoot anybody who doesn't follow their every command?
You're out of step here, not me.
WP - "cops" (in general) don't just shoot someone because they do not obey every instruction, and nobody anywhere is suggesting that they shoot anyone just for not obeying instructions. That claim is silly unsubstantiated hyperbole that objectively has no business being taken seriously.
Cops shoot when they feel they are in danger. There are certain instructions in certain situations like "drop your weapon" or "show me your hands" that can absolutely get you shot if you refuse to follow them. That's basic common sense. If someone wants to push that issue and ends up shot. That's on them, not the cop.
I would think you would be smart enough to see the difference between a cop who shoots someone because of potential danger, and a cop who shoots someone because they won't move to the other side of the street as asked. I believe we are talking about the former (where a cop feels in danger) and you are pretending it's the latter, because the former doesn't make a very good argument.
The sitting prez is almost as stupid as Hillary..
"He (obimbo) said "Black Lives Matter Movement," saying it's not anti-police."
Really, BlackLiesMatter is now a PRO-Police Organization.
CHT said ... That claim is silly unsubstantiated hyperbole that objectively has no business being taken seriously.
On the contrary, it is literally what happened in the case you and I are discussing.
This is what happens when you rely so much on generalities that you completely overlook the specifics under discussion. You wind up looking foolish with this kind of rant.
wphamilton said...
Just how many citizens do you think you can find, that would agree with you that we need cops that will shoot anybody who doesn't follow their every command?
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it depends upon the command. i have in the past vociferously disagreed with a police officer. he said i was speeding, i said i was not, etc. they expect that, are trained to deal with it, and they will tolerate a great deal. it comes with the job.
but non compliance with basic and life endangering commands? where they have just seconds to evaluate a threat and formulate an appropriate response? a response where if they're wrong they die?
that's a different kettle of fish.
i've been pulled over while armed. i kept my hands on the wheel and the only muscles i moved were those required to blink. i informed the officer that i'm in possession of a firearm (stowed in the back seat and unloaded) and i asked him how he would like me to proceed. every move i made from that point was deliberate and smooth, not rushed or sudden, and the traffic stop went off without incident.
when dealing with a person who is trained and armed to take your life on the spot, you do what you're told, and only what you're told. it's not rocket science, but it does require a modicum of intellect. perhaps that's what's lacking in many of these cases on the part of the deceased.
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