Some legal "experts" suggest that New York could (and would) prosecute him for those same crimes at a state level if Trump issued a pardon. The argument goes that the President has no authority to pardon Manafort a second time if he were to be found guilty in a New York court.
These "experts" would be correct to say that the President's authority to pardon someone is limited to violations of Federal law (not State law). But these so called "experts" are missing one key issue. The state of New York has a law on the books that prohibits state prosecutors from charging an individual who has previously been charged in "a court of any jurisdiction within the United States” for the "same core facts".
Now apparently certain people within the state of New York (including NY Attorney General Eric Schneiderman) have urged the legislature in New York to "close the loophole" in anticipation of a possible pardon of Manafort. However, the idea that New York does not want to charge the same person for the same actions is not a "loophole" - it is actually the fundamental goal of the law. Changing a law cannot be done via executive action or a court order. It would take a repeal of the law.
But even if a repeal was passed and signed by the Governor, the issues of ex post facto would come into play. The state would be constitutionally obligated to treat the Manafort case within the laws that existed at the time of his conviction. You cannot create a law (or change a law) and then go back and retroactively charge someone for something that they could not have been charged for at the time.
So it would appear that the President actually much more leverage in this case than people would like to admit. Certainly Mueller has the stick, but Trump has the ultimate carrot he can dangle.
57 comments:
schneiderman is gone, booted from office for slapping the shit out of the girls he was dating, and we've just elected an AG whose IQ is on par with assholio fuctardio cortez.
if anything happens with this here in NY i suspect cuomo himself will have to get involved, and i'm not sure he's willing to pick that battle.
The "experts" are Ivey League educated lawyers. Not a paper pusher on an obscure blog.
Blogger Roger Amick said...
The "experts" are Ivey League educated lawyers. Not a paper pusher on an obscure blog.
it's called an opinion, alky. and one he's entitled to have.
how's YOUR blog coming along? any chance it's done in time for the new year?
The "experts" are Ivey League educated lawyers.
Assuming you mean Ivy league.... which lawyers are you talking about?
Rat
Ol Rog was talking about the NY Times when he talked about obscure paper pushers...
Right now, New York state law prevents people from being prosecuted more than once for crimes related to the same act, even if the original prosecution was in federal court. There are already a number of exceptions to the law, and the letter says that Mr. Schneiderman is proposing to add a new one that could be used if federal pardons are issued.
If the proposed law is passed, anyone indicted on state charges after being convicted in federal court and then pardoned would likely challenge the state law in court. But Mr. Schneiderman wrote in the letter that he and his advisers were confident the legislation would withstand any constitutional scrutiny.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/18/nyregion/schneiderman-trump-mueller-pardons.html
Assuming you mean Ivy league
You figured that all by your loathsome white old man self?? Scotty ???? BWAAAAAAAAA!!
Mueller shopping the book and movie of his story to Hollywood.
$$$$$$$%
Lol, got to love Alky's envy of a college education.
Dusty old white man Denny pipes in wearing his overalls, straw hat, and tells all of us young whippersnappers what's up.
Lol, got to love Alky's envy of a college education.
Not as envious of a college education as Dennis is.
Not as envious of a college education as Dennis is.
Did they have colleges back when dusty old white man Denny was that age?
We had a memorial service for George H.W Bush today. I noticed that you were unwilling to post about this. The comparisons between these two Presidents was very revealing that 41 and 45 is very revealing. Trump showed no respect to the memories.
From the moment he crossed the transept of the soaring Washington National Cathedral, tore off his overcoat and took his seat in the front pew, President Trump was an outsider.
When the others sang an opening hymn, his mouth did not move. When the others read the Apostles’ Creed, he stood stoically. And when one eulogist after another testified to George H.W. Bush’s integrity and character and honesty and bravery and compassion, Trump sat and listened, often with his lips pursed and his arms crossed over his chest.
Wednesday’s state funeral was carefully orchestrated to be about one man and his milestones — Bush the father, the friend, the war hero and the lifelong public servant. But inevitably it became about Trump, too, for it was impossible to pay tribute to the 41st president without drawing implicit contrasts with the 45th.
“His life code was: ‘Tell the truth. Don’t blame people. Be strong. Do your best. Try hard. Forgive. Stay the course,’ ” Bush biographer Jon Meacham said in his eulogy. “And that was, and is, the most American of creeds.”
The mourners did not deliver the searing rebukes of Trump the nation witnessed in September for the funeral of Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.).
But despite being crafted to honor Bush’s legacy, their words also served to underscore the singular nature of Trump’s presidency.
Trump was in the company of all his living predecessors for the first time Wednesday, and the encounter was plainly uncomfortable. By 10:49 a.m., when Trump and first lady Melania Trump stepped into the cathedral, a cool hush had come over the pews filled by American dignitaries and foreign leaders, past and present. Trump handed his black overcoat to a military aide and took his seat on the aisle next to his wife, with three past presidents and first ladies seated to her side.
First was the president Trump said was illegitimate (Barack Obama); then the first lady he called a profligate spender of taxpayer dollars (Michelle Obama); then the president he called the worst abuser of women (Bill Clinton); then the first lady and secretary of state he said should be in jail (Hillary Clinton); and then the president he said was the second-worst behind Obama (Jimmy Carter) and his wife, Rosalynn.
The Trumps and the Obamas greeted each other brusquely, but only Melania Trump reached over to shake hands with Bill Clinton. Hillary Clinton did not acknowledge the Trumps, keeping her gaze straight ahead as if determined not to make eye contact with the man who continues, two years after the 2016 election, to inspire “Lock her up!” chants at his rallies.
During the Jon Meacham Trump eulogy had his arms crossed. As his son George W Bush spoke I was in tears.
Trump's funeral will be held in hell.
The next eulogist, former Canadian prime minister Brian Mulroney, praised three of Bush’s achievements in office — negotiating the North American Free Trade Agreement, the Americans With Disabilities Act and the Clean Air Act.
“There’s a word for this. It’s called ‘leadership,’ ” Mulroney said. “Leadership. And let me tell you that when George Bush was president of the United States of America, every single head of government in the world knew that they were dealing with a gentleman, a genuine leader — one who was distinguished, resolute and brave.”
President Trump and first lady Melania Trump arrive for the funeral. (Mandel Ngan/AFP/Getty Images)
It was not lost on the audience that Trump has slammed NAFTA as one of the worst trade deals ever; mocked a journalist’s physical disability; and rolled back scores of environmental regulations.
ADVERTISING
Trump sat through much of Mulroney’s speech crossing his arms over his chest or holding his hands between his knees, at times leaning forward in his seat.
Trump’s body language loosened up when former senator Alan Simpson delivered a lighter and more humorous remembrance of his longtime friend. Trump laughed as Simpson told stories about serving in Washington with Bush; at one point, Simpson sang the most famous line from the play “Evita”: “Don’t cry for me, Argentina!”
But Simpson, too, conveyed a more serious lesson as he spoke of Bush’s humility and kindness. “Those who travel the high road of humility in Washington, D.C., are not bothered by heavy traffic,” he said, adding later, “Hatred corrodes the container it’s carried in.”
As he assumed the presidency, Bush summoned all Americans to create a “kinder” and “gentler” nation — a message that Trump, then a Manhattan real estate developer and tabloid celebrity, found lacking.
“I like George Bush very much and support him and always will,” Trump said in a 1990 interview with Playboy. “But I disagree with him when he talks of a kinder, gentler America. I think if this country gets any kinder or gentler, it’s literally going to cease to exist.”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bush-funeral-trump-sits-with-fellow-presidents-but-still-stands-alone/2018/12/05/fdc6663a-f8a3-11e8-8d64-4e79db33382f_story.html
Trump applauded Bush’s speech, and then the Rev. Dr. Russell Jones Levenson Jr., who had been Bush’s pastor at St. Martin’s Episcopal Church in Houston, took to the pulpit to deliver a final, stirring eulogy. His was as direct a reference to the Trump era as any.
“Some have said this is an end of an era,” Levenson said. “But it doesn’t have to be. Perhaps this is an invitation to fill the void that has been left behind.”
After the choir sang and bells rang, after Bush’s casket was carried down the center aisle and as it was loaded into a hearse, the Trumps departed the cathedral quickly through a side exit. The president was whisked back to the White House. He returned to the seclusion and comfort of the Oval Office.
The bone spur draft dodger President had to escape from reality and hide on Twitter.
Trump lies dozens of time a day. Yet you sit there and praise him because you hate liberals.
I'm a patriot.
You put politics first.
I think about the country first, the people second and third is decency.
Senator Allen Simpson pointed out the President was a decent man who never hated anyone. Trump is the polar opposite of George H.W Bush. I have no doubt that he knew what he was saying this directly at Trump.
And he had a very serious flaw known by all close to him. He loved a good joke, the richer the better, and he'd throw his head back and give that great laugh, but he never, ever could remember a punch line. And I mean never. So the punch line for George Herbert Walker Bush is this: you would have wanted him on your side.
ADVERTISEMENT - CONTINUE READING BELOW
He never lost his sense of humor. Humor is the universal solvent against the abrasive elements of life. That's what humor is. He never hated anyone. He knew what his mother and my mother always knew: hatred corrodes the container it's carried in. Trump is completely corroded.
The most decent and honorable person I ever met was my friend, George Bush. One of nature’s noblemen. His epitaph, perhaps just a single letter, the letter "L" for loyalty. It coursed through his blood. Loyalty to his country, loyalty to his family, loyalty to his friends, loyalty to the institutions of government and always, always, always a friend to his friends.
Trump always demands loyalty to him first. Not the country. Not the people.
Spelling correction can't Scott use it to ignore the Ivy league lawyers. Or Senator Alan Simpson.
Wow Rog...
You actually believe George H.W. Bush's funeral was about Trump.
Please seek psychiatric help.
Trump briefly shook hands with former president Barack Obama and his wife, Michelle. Beyond that exchange, the four presidents in the front row seemed incapable of even fleeting contact. Former president Bill Clinton glanced quickly in Trump’s direction and then looked away. Rather than shake Trump’s hand, former president Jimmy Carter checked his watch.
Trump, arms folded across his chest, stared stoically throughout, as traits of his predecessor, so different from his own, were praised.
No. It was about the man who was decent and a loving man and President.
I'm using it to show you that the President you love so much that you ignore his lies and irresponsible behavior as President. Senator Alan Simpson deliberately directed his comments on hatred and loyalty. With the exception of his son, George W Bush the speakers all either intentionally or otherwise called attention to how a real man acted as President.
Your Trumpism is out of control Scott.
He was a very good man and President.
No one will praise the character of Trump. Except maybe you.
psychiatric care is not going to get rid of your Trumpism stage four brain cancer.
Get your head out of your ass and think.
But you are not the same person from soars. Something happened.
You sit there and praise him because you hate me.
I'm a patriot.
You put politics first.
I think about the country first, the people second and third is decency.
I don't hate Trump.
He's the worst President in history as of today. You hate liberals
Not one negative comment. Not one.
Barely two years later, on the Monday after Thanksgiving, General Motors announced that it was closing major auto plants in Michigan, as well as Ohio and Maryland. Thousands of jobs are being cut, and the future for many of the remaining plants suddenly seems very insecure.
Trump, the candidate who claimed in 2016 that his Democratic rival “hasn’t got a clue” about how to maintain American manufacturing, is now exposed as the president who really hasn’t got a clue about keeping plants open and keeping workers on the job.
https://www.rawstory.com/2018/12/watch-living-us-presidents-recite-christian-apostles-creed-except-evangelical-hero-donald-trump/#.XAgf9ZSrRoA.twitter
Roger, no worries. Trump will be impeached by Jan 31st, 2019. Your team promised, Mueller has the "shoes", right?
My Requirements for 2016 vote for President.
1, be Trump
After Trump won.
1, mock the Left, Hillary by 10%.
2, end medical insurance mandate
3, cut my taxes
4, rebuild the US Military
5, exit climate hoax that Obimbo got us in
6, remove regulation on business and ranchers/farmers like me.
7, tweet
Again, Roger shows how little he knows about everything but booze.
"Barely two years later, on the Monday after Thanksgiving, General Motors announced that it was closing major auto plants in Michigan, as well as Ohio and Maryland. Thousands of jobs are being cut, and the future for many of the remaining plants suddenly seems very insecure."
Really, I thought Obama saved GM. Another tick in Obama's loss ledger.
Lost Years still hurting the US Economy.
Do you have any idea how insignificant that total is compared to what walmart ships to china .." Dennis
No, do tell?
No, do tell?
China trade deficit last year....$556 billion.....How many beaners shipping 35K a year does it take to come up to the same total asshole????? Idiots
Apperently Roger didn't really listen to Simpson's eulogy.
"Hatred corrodes the container it's carried in"
saved GM. Another tick in Obama's loss ledger.
And trump promised millions of manufacturing jobs....another broken promise....Merry Christmas, America....I'm doing just fine with my megamillion hotels making lots of money from foreigners coming into the country!!!!
walmart ships to china .." Dennis
Failure is your Denise, I just quote you.
At the Bush Funeral Hillary Clinton sowed her true colors, Red raging classless Anger.
"And trump promised millions of manufacturing jobs.."
So far he is doing well. Let's see in 6 more years how he finishes.
CNN Mathews backs Fake Beaner O'rorke
Never saw Trump more out of place than standing with his peers. He’s without empathy so did not understand this event, and because no one mentioned his name he wasn’t interested. He embarrassed himself being there, and should have sent his wife. https://t.co/wOjeaFaq6u
Failure is your Denise, I just quote you.
Ships money asshole that's what trade deficit means!!....I made the mistake of presuming you have a minimal ability to think....I was obviously wrong!!
Trump, the candidate who claimed in 2016 that his Democratic rival “hasn’t got a clue” about how to maintain American manufacturing, is now exposed as the president who really hasn’t got a clue about keeping plants open and keeping workers on the job.
Kput'z shut up. Your ignorance is unbelievable. Trump is the President today, not Obama. The layoffs are on his table. Your low double digit IQ is evident again and again and again.
So far he is doing well.
BWAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!! Keep chewing on his big fat white old ass goat fucker....It does serve your stupidity well.>>>>>!!!!
People on Twitter are calling out President Donald Trump for failing to recite the Apostles’ Creed at the funeral for former President George H. W. Bush on Wednesday.
Footage from the event shows much of the church, including the former presidents seated with Trump, standing to recite the profession of faith.
Trump and first lady Melania Trump stood, but did not recite the prayer, which was written in the program, nor did they sing the hymns.
Given Trump’s widespread support among evangelical Christians, that led to plenty of criticism on social media:
John Dean
Roger, are you on the verge of voting for Trump in 2020?
Blogger C.H. Truth said...
Rat
Ol Rog was talking about the NY Times when he talked about obscure paper pushers...
yeah, that's an old story based upon the same kind of wishful thinking on the part of my former AG as the alky trades in around here each day.
the fact is, NY hasn't had a competent AG in recent memory. what we've had were a series of assholes and bullies who couldn't litigate their way out of a wet paper sack. but they sure either liked their whores or liked slapping the shit out of the women stupid enough to date them.
and now we've elected some dim wit who was NYC's public advocate or some such nonsense.
if you're a NY'er you're given several reasons each day to seek shelter elsewhere in retirement.
i see the alky went on a copy/paste tirade.
the alky would like us to think he has much to say.
then he proceeds to say nothing at all.
Given Trump’s widespread support among evangelical Christians
A stunning statement of how stupid the public can be....especially with trumps prowess to buy or grab any pussy he can get his hands on....I guess fidelity to evangelicals is dependent on picks for the SCOTUS no matter what he does....!!!!
People on Twitter are calling out President Donald Trump for failing to recite the Apostles’ Creed at the funeral for former President George H. W. Bush on Wednesday.
This is Mickey Mouse bullshit. I not surprise it's on the TDS infected wing of twitter not am I particulary surprise you posted it.
Blogger Roger Amick said...
Not one negative comment. Not one.
Barely two years later, on the Monday after Thanksgiving, General Motors announced that it was closing major auto plants in Michigan, as well as Ohio and Maryland. Thousands of jobs are being cut, and the future for many of the remaining plants suddenly seems very insecure.
well dumb fuck,
had 0linsky allowed GM to restructure in bankruptcy, this could've all been avoided. but skeets thought it better to double down on the monument to galactic stupidity that is the UAW. so here we are.
you know alky, after watching the state funeral over the past couple days it appears to me that if GM ever lost their federal government contract they'd be out of business inside of 30 days.
Roger Amick said...
People on Twitter are calling out President Donald Trump for failing to recite the Apostles’ Creed at the funeral for former President George H. W. Bush on Wednesday.
huh. you don't say?
i'm glad to hear that trump was able to trigger so many people by simply doing nothing.
been to church lately alky? have you taken a moment to thank God that someone died so that you may live to continue the epic failure that is your life ?
let he who is without sin cast the first stone
drop the stone, alky.
and hit your knees and give thanks that God chose to save your worthless ass. nothing that you've ever done has earned the gift, so i'm left to conclude that the Lord must've been feeling extra generous that day.
had 0linsky allowed GM to restructure in bankruptcy
You should keep doing what you do best....a loser salesman with a bigots attitude....Almost as stupid a statement as the goat fucker wondering what trade deficit means.....Restucturing has nothing to do with the market changes over the past few year....Cars out, trucks, crossovers and small suv's are in.....asshole...
I'm using it to show you that the President you love so much that you ignore his lies and irresponsible behavior as President. Senator Alan Simpson deliberately directed his comments on hatred and loyalty. With the exception of his son, George W Bush the speakers all either intentionally or otherwise called attention to how a real man acted as President.
alky, scott is right. you and only you saw the beauty of the eulogies yesterday as a shot at trump.
the fact is, each was spoken with grace, humility, and in honor of a truly wonderful, patriotic, and truly consequential american.
ironically, the only person that was addressed yesterday other than 41 was you - in simpson's comments about hatred. it corrodes the container in which it is carried. and you are that container.
i disagree with scott on his advice for you to seek psychiatric help.
don't bother.
you'd be wasting the time of everyone involved.
At the funeral Trump looked presidential while Hillary looked like a bitter old woman.
I think that the President should have acknowledged Apollo Creed at the Funeral too. Especially now that Apollo's son is fighting a mean Russian.
Watched a replay
Only one ex-president had his nose pointing skyward like an arrogant Frenchman. Guess reading from teleprompters usually forced it down but boy was it noticeable when Obama is sitting amongst others. And Bush was very welcoming to the Obama's who spent 8 years blaming him for everything...
Roger posted how Trump left by side door but left out all the ex-presidents did.
Was a beautiful service.
Post a Comment