Obviously the first debate was fought like a drunken bar brawl. While both candidates pulled many of the same stunts, the bulk of the coverage was on the President's behavior and he seemed to take a hit. This debate was more traditional in the sense that both candidates were allowed to talk without interruptions and to the degree that there was open mic banter, it was fairly respectful in comparison to debate one.
The question becomes, was there anything about this debate that could have "moved the needle". To those regards, I would offer that to the extent that the needle moved, that it probably just moved back.
In other words, to the degree that the President may have "lost" potential voters from the first debate, then he probably gained them back after this debate. To be clear, it's fairly obvious that anyone wishy washy enough to be easily swayed by debate one will be just as easily swayed by debate two. Probably the one major theme about last night's debate was that Trump was more "Presidential" than he was in debate one, which seemed to have played very well with the various focus groups that were being held.
There wasn't any real gotcha moments and neither candidate landed any sort of knock out blows. I personally believe that spending a half hour on Covid was both beating a dead horse and a gift to Biden. To the degree that we have been through two debates where the moderators ignored the subject of the President being nominated for multiple Nobel Peace Prizes for multiple successes in foreign policy was blatant omission and another gift to Biden. The fact that these moderators believed that Mideast or Eastern European peace is less important than tin foil hat conspiracies about Russia is fairly scary.
If there was something substantial here, it was the fact that Biden openly stated that he would phase out oil and gas. This will most certainly cost him votes in blue collar states that rely on this. This will be deja vu all over again for people who watched these jobs go away under Obama, watched many of them come back under Trump, only to hear Biden tell them that they will go away again if he was elected.
On a lesser note, the concept of a pathway to citizenship might poll decently, but it will not move votes in favor of Biden. If illegal immigration is a powerful issue for you, then you are likely for more border security, less illegal immigration, and you probably don't want 11 million more illegals becoming citizens overnight. Those who like the concept of feeling good about the idea of a pathway to citizenship probably have way more other important issues in their rainbow colored wish bag.
I wish I could give a solid prediction as to how this will affect things, but that is hard to do when you have little trust that we still have any accurate way to measure these things. My gut tells me that Trump has a bit of momentum right now and that the debate didn't do anything to halt that. But history tells us that these polls will likely close these last few days either way and that this may not be as much a reflection of momentum as it is just a polling correction.
15 comments:
Megyn Kelly
@megynkelly
Trump won this debate, handily. Biden wasn’t a force at all. Trump was substantive, on-point, well-tempered. Definitely helped himself, when it mattered most.
she's not a big Trump fan to say the least...
A couple things stood out
Biden pledge to end oil and gas industry. Some dems already distancing themselves from this.
Trump's impassioned plea to reopen the country. He's right, the cannot be worse than the disease. Even some local mental health experts, democrats, are admitting this.
And a big loser was Chris Wallace. Welker did a far better job.
Rasmussen Reports
@Rasmussen_Poll
Morning Reader Data Points:
National Daily Black Likely Voter Job Approval For @POTUS - October 19-23, 2020
Mon 10/19 - 25%
Tue 10/20 - 24%
Wed 10/21 - 31%
Thu 10/22 - 37%
Fri 10/23 - 46%
this may indicate something significant
Trump Spoke the Language of Fox News
10:11 am
“During the final presidential debate, President Trump made reference to ‘the laptop from hell,’ ‘AOC plus three’ and ‘Russia, Russia, Russia’ — yes, said three times in a row,” the Washington Post reports.
“The material was very familiar to — and maybe only familiar to — regular viewers of Fox News opinion hosts such as Sean Hannity.”
"Said Meet the Press host Chuck Todd: 'I feel like he almost was speaking the language of Fox prime time. If you watch a lot of Fox prime time, you understand what he’s saying. If you don’t, you have no idea.'
"It was a point made over and over again across networks as political commentators and journalists wondered aloud whether Trump’s attacks on Joe Biden flew over the heads of many Americans who aren’t regular consumers of conservative television, radio and websites."
"Said Meet the Press host Chuck Todd: 'I feel like he almost was speaking the language of Fox prime time.
LOL.
darn! Trump's not speaking MSDNC!
LOL.
these msm asshats just cannot grasp the concept that Trump loathes them for a reason.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_biden-6247.html
Oct 21 (before the debate) Biden +7.5
Oct 23 (after the debate) Biden +7.9
This may indicate something significant.
Trump needed to appeal to someone other than the Fox News crowd and didn't.
Tim Young
@TimRunsHisMouth
Joe Biden wants to eliminate oil like his family already made billions off of energy internationally.... oh.
FACT CHECK: FALSE
not billions, just tens of millions
Oct 21 (before the debate) Biden +7.5
Oct 23 (after the debate) Biden +7.9
This may indicate something significant.
yeah... pederast, you're looking at a massive 0.4 tsunami right there!
WHOA!
LOL.
THERE I GO, SLAPPING THAT KNEE AGAIN!
OUCHIE! TIME TO SWITCH KNEES!
Oct 21 (before the debate) Biden +7.5
Oct 23 (after the debate) Biden +7.9
It was at 7.9% yesterday Reverend. You know, on the 22th, which is the day in between the 21st and the 23rd. There has been no polling updates today on RCP.
Trump is appealing to young black and Hispanic voters. That's why Biden had obama in Philadelphia this week.
Trump at the Debate Was Like America: Not Winning
10:50 am
Susan Glasser:
“Donald Trump blew it. Thursday night was his last, best chance to save his Presidency. With a national television audience and a reprieve after his horrible first debate performance and coronavirus hospitalization, the President could have used his second, and final, debate with Joe Biden to make a late play to win the election, which is only eleven days from now. He could have spoken to Americans’ pain and suffering during this unprecedented pandemic and economic crisis. He could have offered a program for recovery, and for his next four years in office.
“But he did not. To anyone who has been watching Trump closely these past few years, that is not a surprise.
"He did not, because he could not.”
9:45 My error. So I guess it went from 7.5 to 7.9 in anticipation, of the debate.
(If you put your cursor on the graph line and move it left and right, you DO get a reading of 7.5 for the 21st with an increase for the 22nd that stays the same for the 23rd.)
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/2020_elections_electoral_college_map_no_toss_ups.html
Doesn't it concern you, Ch, that this still remains the same now FOR AN ENTIRE WEEK?
NO TOSS UPS ELECTORAL VOTE
------- BIDEN 357 TRUMP 181 -------
TRUMP'S PLAN TO MAKE BIDEN LOOK SENILE fizzles
11:22 am
Jonathan Chait:
“In the cold light of day, the most important development from the final presidential debate may be something that did not happen at all: Joe Biden embarrassing himself in a fit of mental disintegration.
“Our minds move so quickly from story to story that it can be easy to forget just how all-consuming the prospects of Biden’s alleged dementia was. To be sure, Biden has lost a step since his prime, and aging has worsened his lifelong stutter, producing some haltering moments he did not have as a younger man. But the charge against him was far more severe:
that he was gone, or almost gone, literally unable to remember basic facts or handle his job.
“The lynchpin of Trump’s strategy in both debates against Biden was to expose his supposed senility…
It didn’t happen. Biden gave perfectly cogent responses to every question put to him, controlled his stammer, and displayed a far stronger command of facts and figures than his opponent.”
__________
LOL
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